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Are the Devs Making the Roster Up As They Go?[CONFIMERED] 
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Now i know what most of you are thinking..."Who is this 'Insert name her' and what is he smoking', well despite what the title says the real question is: "Are the Devs Intentionally Leaving "Open" Spots for Newer Released Characters?" Of course all of that wouldn't fit in the title box, however i will justify the title later.

So, what exactly am i talking about? Well, i believe the devs may be misleading us when they say the roster is already predetermined and we are going speculate on a potential theory that could solve/disprove this

First and foremost(and please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) the Devs have stated that they said the roster was finalized to stop the flood of character request they were(are? Not as much?) getting. And even if I'm wrong on this point there is some evidence that supports that the Devs could be potentially either lying straight out about the roster(not really likely and I'll explain why) or the Devs have set a specific roster in place(or a specific number of character slots) and have set aside some of those slots for more recent character additions. Now knowing that it be incredibly hard to build a game of this caliber without a sound plan, I'm just gonna explain my reasoning for the latter rather than the former.

Super Smash Bros has been a series of games that has always(well, since Brawl and Smash4) combined a list of both iconic characters with obscure classic characters and new and upcoming characters. For example, Brawl made R.O.B. a playable character while also introducing Ike(who was the main character of the most recently released Fire Emblem game at that time). Smash 4 also saw the return of Duck Hunt Dog as well as the inclusion of Corrin From FE Fates and Greninja from Pokemon X and Y(which again was the most recent title in its franchise at the time). So, we all know that SSF2 has been in development since 2007-2008; we also know that the roster was revamped/finalized around 2012-2013. Its now 2018(which is kinda hard to say), that means that EVERY character even remotely considered "new" at the time would be a passing thought by now. A perfect example of this is continuing franchises with a rotating roster. Not to many people are gonna talk about bringing in Greninja or any of the starters from Kalos and Unova being in a smash game now that we have the Alola starters. And Lucina, Robin and Chrom are way old news now that FE Fates has been out, and eventually even those characters will fade into our memories once FE for Switch releases. The point I'm trying to make here, from a Developers standpoint(not our Devs specifically but anyone who develops a game of this sort), finalizing a roster for a game you know won't release for at least another 2-3yrs doesn't make much sense, unless its done in a way that allows the Devs to have a little wiggle room. Lets say for example in 2013 the devs decided among themselves that the finalize roster would include:

    Bowser
    Pit
    Luffy
    Gen VI-VII Pokemon Character
    Fire Emblem Character
    1st Party Newcomer
    1st Party Newcomer

Now some of you may look at this and say "that's the same as having no plan at all, smh", but this is actually more plausible than you may think. First off, half the roster wouldn't be blank slots, only a few(lets say 2-4 maybe 5 for the sake of arguments and whatnot) would be blank slots. So currently we are sitting at 39 characters, a good 10-11 of those characters came after 2013(we're gonna go ahead and exclude :marth: , :zerosuitsamus: and :chibirobo: from this list since they had to have already been in some form of development by the time the roster was finalized). All these character are then apart of the roster established in 2013. So where does that leave are "blank spots" and how would developing these random characters not cause issues in some way? Well, these "blank spot" characters would be developed LAST(or for the final release). This would prevent the Devs from running into a situation where they fill these "blank spots" but don't know when they'll be finished/releasing the game. If they know it takes "X" amount of time to finish "X" amount of characters(of course depending on the difficulty of spriting the characters) it would be easier to make these characters last priority. Not taking away the time it takes to come up with a moveset for these characters as well and to simply choose the right ones! But a 2yr gap between the release of a game(lets say Pokemon Ultra Sun and Moon, and this is assuming the final version releases within the next 2yrs) sounds a lot better than a 5yr gap(Pokemon X and Y) and 3 and a half games later(at the time of writing this). Adding them late in the game as hidden/unlockable characters also gives the fans a big surprise cause who would be expecting(For Example) Inkling or Inceneroar or Ribbon Girl? But lets be real here adding ANY character is work and someone is always gonna have to come last. This wouldn't even extend production time since they would have already planned to make the characters later in development or for the final release. And we know the Devs haven't even finished releasing all the content for Beta(Demo 1.0). If this is how the roster was finalized this allows the Devs to play around a little. They now have access to Nentindo(and other 3rd parties as well) roster of newer characters. Now there is small(but not complete hard proof) evidence of the Devs making changes to the roster. This exception to the rule is of course :sandbag:(it may have been easier sprite wise, but I doubt it was easier code wise). Its completely possible that the Devs planned it out ahead of time, and this again is thinking about it from a developers standpoint. We also now from interviews with Masahiro Sakurai himself that this is how he's gone about adding characters to official Smash games. Greninja(and again correct me if I'm wrong) didn't even have a finalized design when he was chosen for Smash4. Adding these "blank spots" allows the Devs to make up the last remaining characters in the roster as they go towards the end of development. And maybe the more fun part, it opens up the possibility for a Gen VI/VII Pokemon, Inklings, ARMS characters, Shovel Knight, Shantae, Snipperclippers(?). And those are just the few options.

And there it is, a long post about why i believe the roster is both finalized and unfinalized. And how i think it would work if it wasn't. Put your comments and your thoughts below(i know you will anyway but...y'know...stuff).

P.S. DLC?
For those of you that will cry "The Devs are waiting for DLC!" Well, first the Devs have stated that DLC is no longer confirmed but isn't unconfirmed. Second, the Devs have stated they want to go into more professional/mainstream video game development(a mans gotta eat). Creating DLC(not saying they wouldn't) would delay that. Simply put, the longer it takes to finish the game, the less likely DLC gets. Its probably more likely for them to place all their plans for DLC into the final release than to drag it out and to spend extra months(knowing MG, years) to release all the planned DLC as DLC.

[UPDATE]
TSON Confimed it!

tson wrote:
I can confirm that it was slotted in the way you describe. As it stands right now though we're far enough in development where those slots are pretty much filled in.

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Last edited by blackking1700 on Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:02 pm, edited 3 times in total.



Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:18 am
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:pacman: <--- I've always thought that this boi's conversion from AT to playable character pretty much refutes the claim that all of the roster was finalised back then

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Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:49 am
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☻Danny☻ wrote:
:pacman: <--- I've always thought that this boi's conversion from AT to playable character pretty much refutes the claim that all of the roster was finalised back then


Well, :pacman: was one of the first assists to be added in the game, which was back in 2011. Its not impossible to believe the Devs had planned to make him playable. That said, i do believe they heavily revamped his moveset to fit Smash4's moveset. Something that would have been done for Bowser as well if they hadn't been half way through spriting the character when Smash4 released. After all, :falco:, :pit:, :megaman:, :peach:, :sheik: and others all received revamps to their playstyle or were designed based on Smash4. :zerosuitsamus: is an example of a character that was sprited before Smash4's release(and announcement) and so her moveset is based off of Brawl. Lets also note that each character who released before Smash4, during the Brawl/PM days, but got their movesets altered to better fit their Smash4 counterparts later, all required resprites or overhauls to their sprites(example: :megaman: , :wario: ).

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Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:52 pm
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☻Danny☻ wrote:
:pacman: <--- I've always thought that this boi's conversion from AT to playable character pretty much refutes the claim that all of the roster was finalised back then


There's also ---> :bandanadee:

As a matter of fact, I still remember making a whole write-up on why PAC and Bandana were solid picks for SSF2. I don't know if it's possible for me to post it her now since it was posted in the twilight months of v0.9b, and that version of the forums seem to have been removed by the mods.

If that's the case, I'll just give the summary.

PAC and Bandana were ATs in v0.7 due to the simple fact that there was virtually no moveset potential for them at the time. PAC was even removed from Brawl for this very reason and Bandana Dee only had Megaton Punch as an attack. Come Beta, and Smash 4 has been a thing for 2-3 years, and Kirby Returns to Dream Land was Bandana's first playable appearance with his trusty spear.


Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:28 pm
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I can confirm that it was slotted in the way you describe. As it stands right now though we're far enough in development where those slots are pretty much filled in.

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Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:38 am
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tson wrote:
I can confirm that it was slotted in the way you describe. As it stands right now though we're far enough in development where those slots are pretty much filled in.

Good to know, thanks.

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Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:39 am
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tson wrote:
I can confirm that it was slotted in the way you describe. As it stands right now though we're far enough in development where those slots are pretty much filled in.


Wow, didn't expect a confirmation. If you don't mind me asking, when did you guys decide on the last character to fill these slots? Not asking for the characters of course, but a timeline for speculative purposes. :)

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Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:56 pm
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