I can agree the matchup is actually in Fox's favour, but not by much (it might just be even tho). Both characters combo each other well, Fox has a distinct advantage in the the neutral game, not just with the fact that he has shine but because NAIR BEATS SIDE-SPEC (so Fox doesn't even need to change what he does lol), and edgeguarding is pretty much even I'd say (Naruto isn't very good at Edgeguarding but Fox doesn't take many hits to die while offstage; Fox is alright at Edgeguarding Naruto but the shine as it turns out didn't work very well on Naruto's up-spec).

Also, at very low percents Naruto's utilt has more lag than it does hitstun so a buffered shine gets Fox out of this combo.

Juggle wasnt the right word, what i should have said is that its a cookie cutter combo that abuses his fall speed and is ridiculously good for racking up percentage and sending him off

I would rather make it a finisher or finish off with a juggle.

@Wright
You underestimate Naruto's edge guarding. I also all ready Nair beats his projectiles.

Also can any of you guys use the word reflector instead of shine?

Stop being pernickity for the sake of it, Niyare, it's been called shine by the smash community since forever.

Shine is accepted terminology for the move, in the same way that no one mentions Captain Falcon's fair.

Naruto has good juggles and decent edgeguarding against Fox (although he's limited by the fact that side-B hits to the stage and down-B is hard to land quickly on opponents in front of you and not below you), but Fox's close-range game is just so much better. Naruto has decent normals, but not compared to Fox's insane rushdown and pressure.

it's called a f*** shine

Yeah.

I do agree with that.

I think with shine is just the same with how I feel about people calling meteor smashes spikes.

@Gosick
Can you at least spell my name right or not reply to me at all. We have been over this.

@Jammy
Okay we get it and their was need for that language. Also why did you even come?

But a shine is the exact same thing as a reflector, meteor smashes and spikes are two separate things.

*Niayre, was that really necessary, my point is still valid regardless of how I spelled your name. We haven't, I've not spoke to you on many occasions.

He came because it's called the f*** shine

Nairye makes having actual discussions extremely difficult

nah nyreiar makes things interesting
my b it's nyiera right?

can't wait for beta clone mine nerf tho plz mickloddo

Thanks I know I do

@Jammy
Thanks man, I love you to. I saw you yesterday and I was like boy he looks awesome.

I know what you guys are talking about when fighting Naruto online now. However, It's just some players and I'm able to get them to one stock most of the time. Certain characters I can do it with while others get destroyed.

However, I think the active hitboxes of his side special and fully charged neutral special should be lessened a little bit.

I'm having mixed feelings on the viability of down tilt. It's basically a situation kill move that I rarely use cause of abysmally range. Sure it's fast but it's not something you can combo into at kill percentage. It's a useless poke tool because you can shield grab him through active frames. This plus the fact that it's not a solid KO option till around 120-130 makes the risk of using it greater than the reward. I'd say it's just a tad bit better than his up smash( which sucks for similar reasons). Thoughts?

Out of crouch it's not bad. You can do sick mind games with crouching out of dash-dance with this tool, and it's not bad on shield either. However, it is limited by it's range, so obviously Rasengan is a better kill move. However, it kills solidly and is one of his best grounded kill moves.

I agree. However, his up smash is still good at being a combo finisher and a kill move that can combo into if you do it right.

Down tilt I would say is like a surprise KO move, that you would do when the opponent least expects it. I would rather not give them any hints I am about to do it by crawling like how I know when a Greninja is about to perform Shadow Sneak by the way it moves.