Welp. If you guys wanna think ZSS is broken, go ahead.
This Mu chart is basically copying the current tier list and pasting it into an mu chart.

tbh it is

That's honestly one your bigger faults, Kyoz; you don't adapt well to abnormal tactics. You seem to have a set formula of strategy to firmly stick to that is really strong, so you don't have to adjust much as it'll possible defeat counter measure you come across. but randomness seems to throw off your rhythm, and a wise players can capitalize if they get you in a vulnerable position. And your fall-back method of dealing with that problem tends to be changing characters for a better match-up.

When we play Zamus vs. Kirby, it's always fairly close in matches, going last stock, last hit situational almost every time, but you clutch it out more than 3/4 of the time because Zamus has better, safer tools to get that winning hit, unlike Kirby.

But I fight other Zamus players that are way worst than you they seem even harder to beat for my Kirby because they play super-defensive, trying to mask their lack of good fundamentals. Just constant abuse of all her whip-based attacks becoming a defensive wall that Kirby can't challenge or punish consistently.

Also think you're confusing the frustration with fighting Sora and making that out as the difficulty of the MU. Sora's design mainly creates a super-safe playstyle that takes tons of exchanges and reads to deal with. But he's still a weak character all-round. I agree with this match-up with on Zelda and Mario (I actually think he beats Sora even worst, more like 65/35). But that doesn't mean Sora is any less of a pain to fight against. I hate fighting Sora whether the players is skilled or a scrub. He just draws out matches with a tons of safe moves and combo-breakers. It's never enjoyable to face him for 5-6 minute. But I'll still end up 3-stocking him after that long-ass match.

I don't think ZSS is broken. And it isn't copying the current BR tier list into a MU chart. Look at


Safe? How? Also, his only useful combo breaker is up b.

The problem is, you actually think that I try against you. I don't have to try to win against your scrubby playstyle.

~You got a friend in me~

Pow pow shots have been fired

Bang Bang

How is his UpB is only useful combo breaker? Its highly punishable and plus he has Nair and DownB? Plus Mario's moves aren't that risky. Bait and punish, gg

Nair is OK I guess, but only for horizontal combos and up b is useful for avoiding vertical combos. It's worked for me before. And how is down b good for combo breakers? That start up lag is horrid if you wanna break combos.

SORRY I THOUGHT YOU MEANT MARIO OMG *BibleThump*

Btw yeah I agree that Sora has no good ways out of getting out of combos besides UpB.

Im sure you already know this, but the numbers in an mu tells you who has the advantage when two players of EQUAL SKILL play the mu. Based on that, this mu chart looks extremely rushed. It would be nice if you could tell us what kind of experiments you did to come up with these numbers and who helped you.

I kind of understand where Kyoz is coming from. I get pissed off when people just assume my mains (DK, Lloyd) win every match up