It's not about how good you are as them, it's about how good you see the character as.
I'm not good as Tails either, but I still see him as the best character.

Again same point as before.
And to answer your question both of them are bottom 5

Mind your own business. (ugh!!)

Oh, so you're going to ignore the actual argument I made? No, that's fine.
What I said is true though

So you go here, put up your tier list and then get mad that people disagree with it? Thats bound to happen, the only tier list people agree with is their own (and even thats not always the case), and if you cant deal with it you quite frankly should not have put it here in the first place. People will always discuss the lists in here, and if they think they are bad (and in all honesty, I havent seen a tier list so absurdly off before) it will get critisized.

Can we all just stop fighting about tier lists? Look we all have different opinions about the characters. Can't we all just accept everyone's opinions, please?

But some opinions are just bad, take it from my first tier list which was pretty bad. So no, we can't just accept anyone's opinions beacuse then someone would make a tier list with , , , , and as top tiers and no one would criticize them for having (obviously) wrong views. Just because I am not very good with Marth doesn't mean I won't put him as a top tier because he is a top tier character. That is why you shouldn't base your tier list just on personal opinions but on results and techniques.

You have a point, though. is MY top tier because I have a good play about him and mastered his recovery. I don't play online that much. is MY top tier cause of my combo game with him. I also mastered his recovery. As for someone like , he's MY low tier cause since Beta came out, I have not even touched him a bit. Like you said, just because you're not good at a character does NOT mean you can't put him/her in that tier because they actually belong in that tier. Just because I am not good with Tails (like you said with ) doesn't mean I have to put him as top tier because he is top tier. Thanks, BandanaDeeMain.

NOTE: Not everybody's opinion is bad. Its just on how well they play the characters and their results.

You just agreed with something he didn't say. Tier lists are not about how good you are as the character, it's about how good the character is. I'm very good as Wario, but I'm not going to put him in top tire just because I'm good as him. What he was saying with Marth is that he's not good as Marth, but he know that Marth is a top tier character, so he would still put him there. The way you're explaining your tier placements appears to be whether or not you main them. But that's wrong. You also probably shouldn't make a tier list if there are still characters that you've barely played at all. And on your note, yes not everyone's opinion is wrong, but yours is.

Uh, dude? When you said everyone, that includes ME. Do you think no one should make a tier list but the community?

He said that "not everybody's opinion is wrong, but your's is" That means that you do have a wrong opinion, but other people do have the right opinion. Do you even read what other people are saying?

DUDE, ITS MY TIER LIST! Also, I'm not dumb. Can we just end this silly arguement, please ? I have my opinions, you guys have yours! I'm not making another tierlist!

That's it! Y'all are hating my tierlist so maybe I should show you the proof! Starting with top tiers!

1: Good at his combo game and recovery, but has bad defense. Up-B, dair, fsmash, dsmash, upsmash & dair are good kill confirms.
2: Excellent at his combo game, recovery, and his kill confirms. Fsmash is kinda strong?
3: Good at combo game, recovery, kill confirms. Reflector has good range and kills at high damage.
4: Heavy but slow. Great kill confirms. Good at his recovery and incredibly strong. Side-B is strong. All his smash attacks are strong, too.
5: Good at combo game, recovery and some of his kill confirms. His biggest weakness is sliding after dashing which makes a distraction to me.
6: Awesome at his combo game and recovery. Good at his kill confirms such as Up, Down, Forward Smash & Forward Aerial.
7: Awesome at his combo game, but struggling with his recovery. Strong kill confirms such as downb, sideb, all his smash attacks, and his backair.

Those are my top tiers and their explanations. Will this make you happy?!

1.) Sandbag has one of the most exploitable recoveries in the game due to the fact that he has to literally blow himself up. His recovery is versatile and can cover a lot of ground, but he is very suspectible to getting edgeguarded and usually takes a ton of damage at the very least just from being offstage. Bag is also combo fodder for the entire cast, and he also happens to be super reliant on port in order to make things work. Having poor MUs against pretty much every high/top tier (Marth, Samus, Tails etc) also really does not help his case. Lack of disjoints and not having a reliable projectile (Capsule is too slow in competitive play really) as well as struggling hard with them only makes things worse in a metagame centered around those two attributes. All Bag has going for him is his insane punish game which keeps him around as a threat, but most definetly not a top tier.

2.) Recovery is not exactly "excellent" due to tethers being unreliable as of now. He does essentially get two extra armored mid-air jumps which is quite something, but both of these have a very preditable trajectory and are easily punishable during their ending lag. Luffy also regularly struggles killing (FSmash is hella weak for instance) if his opponent is aware of the common kill setups. His "range" is also more of a hindrance really: Luffy has giant hurtboxes that reach farther than his hitboxes (basically, every time Luffy extends his limbs thats a huge area he can be hit in before his own attack can connect), he lacks disjoints and a reliable projectile just like Bag, and he also suffers immensly from not having port priority.

3.) Falco's recovery is anything but good, what are you on? He has arguably the most linear recovery in the entire game, loss of Up B angles really hurts him a lot. Side B shortens are a mixup that he desperately needs, but offstage Falco should be easy gimp fodder (unless you try to take a port Up B head on). Down B also has rather poor range and doesnt kill nearly as early as you make it out to be. Falco is still a strong character thanks to his crazy combo game, having an excellent projectile and just by virtue of being a spacie (shine pressure, solid frame data all around, Dair), but far too exploitable for his own good - very easy to combo, very easy to edgeguard thanks to a short and predictable recovery, easy to KO due to light weight. A strong glass cannon that most people put in high tier.

4.) Bowser also has one of the worse recoveries in the game - Up B is slow, doesnt travel all that far, and is incredibly telegraphed during travel, his airspeed is lacking, Fireball boosts only work if you have a lot of height to work with. He has a strong combo game, sure, but everyone has that. Bowser is incredibly slow, a huge hurtbox that is very easy to combo for years, struggles landing a lot, struggles offstage lacks disjoints, lacks a quick projectile (still, having Fireball at all is undeniably a major buff), struggles hard against projectiles and disjoints etc. His regular landing animation is also incredibly laggy, making Bowser very poor at air to ground conversions as well as even more suspectible to combos. His saving graces are his range, raw power and edgeguarding game really, but that doesnt make a top tier (look at Melee Ganon for instance) by any means.

5.) Luigi has poor range, a long but very exploitable recovery (Side B and Up B are super linear, while Down B has punishable ending lag), a solid projectile and, as any other character in this game, a good combo game. His range is piss poor, the character has no airspeed at all, his movement is super awkward, he too has issues against disjoints, struggles landing a lot and just gets outclassed as a character in basically every aspect. There are many reasons why almost every even remotely decent tier list puts him at the bottom.

6.) Mario is fast, he has a high damage output, a solid projectile and good kill power, a great recovery and edgeguarding game along the obligatory good combo game. He does however lack range, one of the most important things to have in the current metagame. His limbs are rather short, he doesnt have disjoints and can get walled by disjoint characters rather easily as a result. Not much to say here to be honest, Mario is a solid high tier. Prolly Top 20.

7.) If you really think that Pikachu suffers from a poor recovery then I dont know what to tell you, but that is not the case, even with only 8 angles on Quick Attack. It remains one of the most versatile and unpredictable Up Bs in the entire game, cannot be challenged without disjoints if Pika has port and also doubles as the single best burst movement option in the game - Up B ledge cancels around the stage are scary and not even close to optimized. Ill give you that USmash and FSmash are strong, but DSmash most definetly is not a strong kill move, it doesnt even connect properly. Bair is also rather weak and not as strong as you make it out to be in all honesty. Pikas issues once again lie in lack of range on a majority of his moves (FSmash and DTilt are some of the more obvious exceptions and struggling against them as well as being very light and thus dieing early, but he has a very strong recovery, good edgeguarding tools, Quick Attack, Thunder Jolt, a strong combo game (duh) and very early kill setups thanks to Thunder. High tier character.

Im happy that you finally give some sort of reasoning, even though it is still (mostly) wrong. It at least allows me/us to see where these misconceptions are coming from. And as a disclaimer, noone (at least I hope that) is attacking you directly. You are just providing a poor opinion and giving poor reasoning behind it Im afraid. Thats not meant as an insult either, but thats how it is. Out of curiosity, what makes Tails/Fox/Lloyd low tiers, DK and Samus mid tiers and Chibi/Bomberman/Peach bottom tiers?

[quote="Yangfly Master"]My tier list:
[/quote:
: Why so high!
*HIGHER*
WHYYYY
YES THANK YOU ACTUALLY AGREE FOR ONCE YES!!!
no higher.... *VERY*

My tier list... This has nothing to do with this " well kinda does" but here.