Name (aka Handle):
KingPawn
How old are you?:
13(don't judge pls)
Which characters do you play in SSF2? Why do you play these characters? (Note: do not list characters that are not currently in the game):
I play marth: I have experience with him in other smash games such as brawl and smash 4, but I feel marth in this game is very good and isn't being used to his fullest potential.
I play sheik: She has the overall combos and kill power that marth doesn't have. She is also very fun to play and feels "right" to play for my playstyle.
I play fox: He, like sheik, has the combos and kill power that marth doesn't have. I feel fox is a really easy character to pick up and play.
How much experience do you have with official Smash titles? (SSB64, Melee, Brawl. Include in this answer which characters you play/played.):
I started off my smash experience playing brawl, just casually with my brother. Once smash 4 came out, I started to play it seriously(kinda), even though I am not very good at it. I also have played melee, but not competitively.
Have you ever attended any Smash tournaments? If so, give some details about the tournament (number of participants, which games, etc). How well did you place?
Besides ssf2 tournaments, I have entered 2 online smash 4 tournaments. I normally placed towards last in both of them. One of them was a 40-man, where I went 0-2, and the other was a 25 man, where I went 1-2.
When did you start playing SSF2?
I have been playing the game since 2009, but started playing competitively in April 2016.
What is your favorite stage in SSF2? Explain.
I feel Tower of Salvation is the best stage, since it is essentially a lagless FD that allows combos to flow freely without any platforms getting in the way. I feel this stage benefits the characters I play as well.
Who, in your opinion, should be placed first on the SSF2 tier list? Under competitive settings why would this character perform on a higher level than all others?
Although many would say MK here, I am obliged to go with Zelda. She has no losing matchups(in my opinion), and rewards high from every hit she gets. Some people say she loses to lloyd or marth, but I believe that she can beat them due to early kills that she gets on those characters.
Who, in your opinion, should be placed last on the SSF2 tier list? Under competitive settings why would this character perform on a lower level than all others?
It is definately wario. Have you seen the lag on his moves? His neutral is by far one of the worst in the games, he has a grab as bad as mario's, barely any kill power besides waft, and a terrible matchup spread. Wario probably beats like 1-2 characters in the whole cast, giving him a disadvantage in the competitive scene.

If you could make only one change to SSF2 as it currently is, what would it be and why?
This is difficult because there are many things I would change, but if I had to make one change, it would be to add lag to DK's up tilt. This move is ridiculously overpowered, it has barely any lag and can be spammed. I've played plenty of DKs that have just used this move 5 times in a row and it is very difficult to get around.
What is your view on items in competitive play?
Items are fun in casual games and FFAs, but in competitive gameplay they should be excluded. Some items are just too overpowered to be even considered to be used in competitive gameplay.
Do you have or can you download Skype? You don't need a mic or webcam.
I can get it.
Why do you want to join the Smash Flash Back Room? What will you contribute? Why are you an exceptional applicant? Be as detailed as possible.
SSF2 seems like a great community, for the short time I've been here(besides leaks). I feel I can help the back room with competitive knowledge(I've entered soooo many ssf2 tourneys) and I want to see the meta evolve from spam to actual neutral and mindgames that you see at top level.

Additional information (Include in this section anything relevant to your application. This could include links to videos of yourself playing.)



Here are just a few matches in tournament.
You can also check my challonge page here: http://challonge.com/users/kingpawn

Use the following stagelist for the questions that reference it:



1. You're in tournament rocking the Marth. You come up against a player who you know plays Zelda only. How do you think striking will go, assuming you have the first strike in a 1-2-1 system and both sides make optimal choices? Explain your reasoning in brief.

2. Analyze the Marth-Zelda MU with great detail (neutral game, punish game, offstage both recovering and edgeguarding, and so on). Conclude with a ratio summarizing your analysis of who has the advantage: 60-40 would mean Marth has an unambiguous but not crushing advantage, whereas 20-80 would mean Marth is hard countered by Zelda and has very little hope against an evenly-skilled player. You can also feel free to expand here on stage choice: what stages favor Marth or favor Zelda? Does the stagelist help Marth or hurt him?

3. Given the analysis you just did, what stage would you want to counterpick to, assuming you lost and they get three bans? What stages would they ban and why?

4. I propose changing the stagelist I gave you by arguing that Tower of Salvation should become a neutral and Yoshi's Story and Battlefield should merge (a single strike or ban removes them both, and the last person to pick the stage determines which one if they are chosen). My argument is that three-platform stages are too powerful for swordsmen to have three of them on one stagelist and WarioWare, and that to balance the top-tier swordsmen we should reduce the amount of bans or strikes an opponent needs to remove those stages from play against swordsmen. Does this argument seem convincing? Would you support this change? If so or if not, why?

Use the following stagelist for the questions that reference it:

STAGELIST
Neutral:
Battlefield
Final Destination/Nintendo 3DS
Smashville
Pokemon Stadium 3
Yoshi's Story

Counterpick:
Dreamland
Tower of Salvation
Castle Siege
Dracula's Castle
Sky Sanctuary Zone
WarioWare
Mirror Chamber


1. You're in tournament rocking the Marth. You come up against a player who you know plays Zelda only. How do you think striking will go, assuming you have the first strike in a 1-2-1 system and both sides make optimal choices? Explain your reasoning in brief.
1. I would strike ToS. The low ceiling of this stage makes zelda kill very early. It also has no platforms, which gives zelda plenty of room to land and makes her up bs hard to predict.
2. The Zelda would strike battlefield. This stage benefits marth highly, because the platforms are low enough that his tippers can cover them. This would make it unsafe to land anywhere for the zelda.
3. I would then strike FD/3ds. Basically the same reason as ToS, and the edges of both stages can be tricky with zelda's down smash covering them.
4. The Zelda would most likely strike yoshi's after this. Even though yoshis isn't as beneficial as battlefield is to marth, it can be cramped and the zelda would get rushdowned easily.
5. I would strike pokemon stadium, leading us to go to smashville. I believe smashville benefits marth in this matchup because the platform is somewhat easy to cover and allows for good combos on zelda.

2. Analyze the Marth-Zelda MU with great detail (neutral game, punish game, offstage both recovering and edgeguarding, and so on). Conclude with a ratio summarizing your analysis of who has the advantage: 60-40 would mean Marth has an unambiguous but not crushing advantage, whereas 20-80 would mean Marth is hard countered by Zelda and has very little hope against an evenly-skilled player. You can also feel free to expand here on stage choice: what stages favor Marth or favor Zelda? Does the stagelist help Marth or hurt him?
Marth-Zelda is heavily punish dependant in my opinion. It is based of whether the marth can stay grounded and get grab combos. Marth in the air is asking to get hit by one of zelda's long-lasting hitboxes. The neutral for marth is very grounded, down-tilt, and grab dependant. The down tilt keeps zelda out, and comes out fast enough to beat zelda's frame data. I feel down-tilt is one of the most useful moves in this match up. The neutral is mostly marth on one side waiting for an opportunity. The zelda will almost never approach marth because of marth's forward air. The way marth racks up damage is waiting for an opportunity to attack and then either getting a down-tilt into a read or a forward throw into dash up tilt. Zelda mostly gets her damage off whiffed attacks from marth, which is why it is best to stay grounded. Since zelda can get loads of damage off 1 hit, it is best for marth not to whiff any attacks because the zelda will be ready to punish it. Overall, I feel marth wins the neutral because he can outspace and get opportunities for punishes better.
Edgeguarding goes heavily in zelda's favor. From my experience in this MU, some zeldas will wait for marth's up b and down smash. This covers missed sweetspot and can cover roll onstage. Marth can't really edgeguard zelda, because he doesn't want to go deep for the edgeguard since zelda can recover from very far away. Marth's best opportunity for edgeguarding is to punish where zelda up bs. If she up bs to ledge, punish her ledge option. If she up bs onto you, shield and grab/aerial depending on the situation. A lot of marth's punishes in this MU can come from reading where zelda lands with her up b and punishing it. Many zeldas will opt to up b downwards onto the stage when they are in the air, and a lot of punishes can spark from that. Overall, zelda beats marth in the edgeguarding department but marth has easier time getting opportunities due to zelda's up b.
Based on my experience and knowledge of the characters, I give : a 50:50 ratio. Marth gets many opportunities to rack up damage but sometimes cannot seal the stock out. Zelda gets little opportunity, but she can punish hard and kill early with either up air or her lightning kicks. Zelda wins edgeguarding by far. Her down-smash sends marth at a very weird angle and is very strong. This can lead zelda to get some early stocks in this MU.

3. Given the analysis you just did, what stage would you want to counterpick to, assuming you lost and they get three bans? What stages would they ban and why?
1. They would ban battlefield. This is the general first ban in any match-up against marth, but specifically in marth-zelda this stage gives marth a huge advantage. The platforms are a perfect height for marth to just f-smash through them, and most marths would counterpick to this stage if it wasn't banned.
2. They would then ban wario-ware. This stage is like battlefield with the platform heights, as well as small blast-zones and an overall structure that benefits marth more than it does zelda.
3. Finally, they would ban Sky Sanctuary Zone. This stage is a bit strange for zelda vs marth. Marth's sword covers the platforms and he can get easy tippers and punishes with the platform heights.
In this match-up, platform stages benefit marth. Although most would say that platforms give zelda more places to run, I feel that the platforms can be an easy way for marth to read zelda's up bs and landings. The platforms also give for some good punishes on the platforms after reading the up b or landing. I would counterpick to Yoshi's Story because of this. The stage is small, cramped, and gives no space for zelda to run. Although marth isn't supposed to rushdown zelda due to her long-lasting hitboxes and punishes, marth will have plenty of opportunities to get punishes on a smaller stage like this where he is closer to zelda. The platform heights also allow for some easier tippers, giving marth kill-power that he would only get on other stages like wario-ware and battlefield.


4. I propose changing the stagelist I gave you by arguing that Tower of Salvation should become a neutral and Yoshi's Story and Battlefield should merge (a single strike or ban removes them both, and the last person to pick the stage determines which one if they are chosen). My argument is that three-platform stages are too powerful for swordsmen to have three of them on one stagelist and WarioWare, and that to balance the top-tier swordsmen we should reduce the amount of bans or strikes an opponent needs to remove those stages from play against swordsmen. Does this argument seem convincing? Would you support this change? If so or if not, why?
This argument is valid for many reasons. I believe stage lists are all about making sure that top tiers don't have serious dominance on every stage. For example, brawl MK was dominant on almost every stage. The 3-platform stages benefit swordsmen very well, and especially marth/lloyd. These characters are both very strong and since a stage list is supposed to make the game a little more balanced. I would support this change, despite my mains.

Bit of a nasty question here, but it's only one.

1) If you were to theorize a player who would be playing Marth to his fullest potential, what do you feel the optimal Marth playstyle would incorporate most, and how far would it affect Marth's tier placing.

1) If you were to theorize a player who would be playing Marth to his fullest potential, what do you feel the optimal Marth playstyle would incorporate most, and how far would it affect Marth's tier placing.

This is a very interesting question. I feel as of now, Marth is around 8th on the tier list. His match-up spread is a bit awkward, with strange MUs against high tiers. But, I think marth could be used a lot better than I, Oreo, even SS use him. The optimal marth playstyle is very patient. This problem has occured with me, when I lose because I lack using marth's defensive options to play patient and not always approach. Patience can be acheived easily with marth due to his fast and large aerials. F-air walls and retreating aerials seem to be useful with this type of marth playstyle. The optimal marth will pick his points, not fish for them, and convert heavily off them. This could definately be useful in match-ups where the enemy is approaching marth: namely fox. This defensive and patient playstyle with marth would be more optimal than the one I and other marths use now because marth really isn't built to be a rushdown approach character like fox. Marth has a big sword, but also a big body that is capable of being hit easily. Marth should stay back, wall out the opponent, and wait for a mistake. If the marth capitalizes off the punish, it shouldn't just be getting 100%. Marth HAS to get the kill early. I normally rate marths on how efficiently they can get the kill(like smash 4 sheik), and not being able to get the kill, especially on characters like sheik and DK, can make marth suffer due to "marth syndrome", when marth lacks a kill move as his opponents gain percent. The best way to play marth would be to pick your points for punishes, and make sure to close out the stock early to avoid not being able to kill. I think a playstyle like this would boost marth much higher, making his match-ups against the high-tiers better. Marth would be around 4-6th on the tier list in my opinion.

The questions keep on coming, sorry!

1. Give your take on the Fox-MK matchup. What is the ratio? Be specific and detailed like last time.

2. Let's say I have another proposed change to the stagelist: Bomb Factory with hazards off should be legalized and replace Mirror Chamber. I argue that Mirror Chamber gives too much of an advantage to the swordsmen who can control the middle platform with disjoints and privileges characters with horizontal kill moves too much. I argue that Bomb Factory, despite having walkoffs, is not that game-breaking because it's at its heart a flat stage and there's counterplay to the strategies that involve abusing walkoffs. Does this seem reasonable? Why or why not?

I got plenty of time, dont worry!
1. Give your take on the Fox-MK matchup. What is the ratio? Be specific and detailed like last time.
This is a little uncomfortable for me, but I'll give it a go!
Bear with me on this one. I've played it a bunch with Jammy, and apparently my fox is good at it. I don't have much experience with MK but I know the basics of what he will do. MK-Fox is kind of like Marth-Fox in the sense that MK waits for fox to make a mistake and then capitalizes off the mistake with a grab or aerial punish. MK gets plenty off grabs against fox, due to fall speed making fox easy combo food. This is basically everything MK will do, besides aerial spacing to pressure fox and stop his approaches.
What Fox has to do in this match-up is very different than all his other MUs. MK is a strange weight for fox to combo off up throw, and the several jumps that MK has makes it difficult to get air combos. From my experience, fox has to basically trap MK's landing with up airs. After ~30% Fox shouldn't go straight for up air out of up throw. 90% of the time MK will jump out and 10% he will airdodge. Most people think MK is untouchable in the air against fox, but reading MK's aerial drift and getting an up air is what fox should do. Fox has to keep getting these little hits until MK is at kill percent, and then an up air read is the normal way I close stocks with fox against MK. Up tilt is also useful for catching MK's airdodge landing onstage. Since up tilt comes out so fast, it is easy to get out of being punished after throwing it out. Hitting the up tilt can also lead to an up air read.
Summarizing this match-up is simple. Fox kills MK VERY EARLY. Either up smash, d-air into up smash, or an up air read can end MK's stocks as early as 70%. MK edgeguards Fox very easily. MK's Back air has a long lasting and disjointed hitbox. This can catch fox out of side b and up b easily when he is recovering. Fox wins neutral and can punish MK hard with strong reads. However, fox doesn't really have any true confirms for early damage on MK. MK's punish game on fox is ridiculous, as every character's is. However, getting the opportunity to punish fox is hard because of his frame data. Sometimes, fox can struggle to get the kill. If the meta knight is not being predictable, he can live to late percents that the fox player does not want. MK normally doesn't struggle to get the kill against fox.
Based on everything I've experienced in this MU, I give : a 6-4 ratio in MK's favor. MK has the punishes down and is much more safe than fox. Fox is read-based in this match-up and doesn't get the guaranteed stuff that he normally gets.
Sorry if that was a little long!

2. Let's say I have another proposed change to the stagelist: Bomb Factory with hazards off should be legalized and replace Mirror Chamber. I argue that Mirror Chamber gives too much of an advantage to the swordsmen who can control the middle platform with disjoints and privileges characters with horizontal kill moves too much. I argue that Bomb Factory, despite having walkoffs, is not that game-breaking because it's at its heart a flat stage and there's counterplay to the strategies that involve abusing walkoffs. Does this seem reasonable? Why or why not?

First of all, I don't like MC being on the stagelist either, because it can be very irritating when a sword character(marth) just f-smashes through the platforms. It's essentially a worse version of battlefield. I hadn't played on Bomb Factory before this, but after testing it out a little, I realized that even without hazards, this stage can be really janky. You said there are counterplay to the walk-offs, which I agree, but comparing this to something as simple as sheik's back-throw f-air, someone could just camp and do something(sheik needles) to force you to approach. Even though it's a large stage, you have to approach eventually. Walk-offs are still easy at lower-level play, because people will fall for it, just like they fall for b-throw fair. My second problem with this stage is the ceiling. There are already plenty of stages with high ceilings, and another one would make some characters a little better, mainly some top tiers(sheik, zelda), because this stage has a high ceiling but VERY close blastzones on the sides.
Thanks for reading all of this

Bumping to make sure this stays relevant.

Bump #2. Hopefully this is still relevant!

Deliberations are currently underway, don't worry.

bump after a month

I personally guarantee, as strange as it sounds, that your app is still under active consideration.

Still under consideration after over a month?

I regretfully have to inform you that your application to the Super Smash Flash Backroom has been denied. We thank you for your patience on how long it took for us to reach a verdict. Please feel free to re-apply in Beta!