I agree completely. I am more of a casual guy , and seeing these moveset changes out of nowhere isn't a thing I can call "acceptable". Trying to go more to the competitive side and letting the casual players in the dust is not fair.

I don't get the mindset that changing moves so they aren't useless or annoying to fight is ruining SSF2.

You see, before it was like this:

Game updates, it changes the metagame. (______ character has lees landing lag, let's just modify the tier list)

Now:

Metagame is evolving, _______ character sucks, game updates with the aspects that sucked about the character being fixed, while taking away all the fun the move had.

Yeah, I'm exaggerating, but I really don't like these competitive-oriented changes, as it strips away the charm the original character had.

What you call "charm", I call uselessness. Isn't it possible to create fun characters and moves that are also competitively viable?

I'm just going to end this conversation.
I know absolutely nothing about competitive smash and I don't want to have anything to do with it, so I'm backing off.
See ya.

In my opinion, it's sorta like this: you keep training with a character, then , after years of training, you reach certain experience. Then out of nowhere, a wild update appears ! New moveset ! You wasted all those years training for nothing. Kys. Kthxbai.
I seriously have those sudden changes. Just like they did with Mario. He had a nice Final Smash , then suddenly it became that fire ... spiral... thingy ? Idfk. I have never seen Mario do that in any of his games.Pls DEVs , bring fire Mario back , that was such a good final smash....

In most cases drastic changes are made to bring characters closer to their smash incarnations, meaning you can channel even more years of expierence from there. We don't give veteran characters entirely new movesets for example. Even Mega Man's redesign was done to combine elements of SSB4 and SSF2 into a more coherent and effective moveset.

The dev team consists of various fans who all enjoy smash differently, I consider myself a casual fan for example. This means that we aim to design our characters in such a way that they display their individual characteristics and charm from their own games but are also effective in higher levels of play. This calls for coherent movesets and when it comes to veterans it's often a case of 'don't fix what isnt broken'. A lot of the 'new' moves Wario's previous moveset had were made due to the limitations at the time, rather than it adding to design and effectiveness. Now that we're better at spriting accurate moves from the ground up we don't have those limitations anymore.

We aren't changing movesets 'just for competetive players'. We're changing movesets to make them better, more coherent, visually and mechanically appealing, smoother and whenever neccesary closer to Smash for everyone.

Well, what if the case was that the 0.9b version represented the character more accurately than actual Smash.
Welp, I better get playing as Wario as much as I can before his vanilla Beta version comes in, despite the gorgeous sprites.

....don't forget, we're still playing a DEMO

0.9b Dash Attack and Pummel with Beta Physics and Effects...
Still Waiting...

I also support that crouch-cancelled-Shoulder Bash idea someone did at the last page, it wouldn't affect casual players' strategies much and competitive players can get "more competitive" with new ATs

How would this be beneficial to wario? SH SideB already give a slight boost and slide and just giving a move with tons of endlag a cancel is NOT the way to go.
The devs are already drastically decreasing the duration of the move. Now, if you had said shield cancelable I'd be less adamant about shutting down this idea because shielding provides many more options

You're not thinking through my head , bro.
It would have little lag , allowing for huge followups.
Imagine like this:
You're away from a campy player.
You crouch-cancel a Side-B.
It allows you to slide for a neat distance, allowing you to follow-up with a D-Tilt or a D-Smash , giving you a choice to launch the opponent w/a D-Tilt, and following with a N-Air , killing at high %s; or make him tumble w/a D-Smash , pressuring him , and with a chance of getting a read roll.
Or if you go by another way, you could try a reverse Chomp, throwing him out of the stage, and following up as you desire.
Even Chomp into Wario Waft, if you are savage enough !

And also , I got the idea of crouch-cancelled Side-B from Wario Land 4 , where it had no lag at all.

I get what you want, you want wario to be able to wavedash.
We don't need a pseudo wavedash for wario, at least not one like that. A shield cancelable SideB provides easily more options for wario, against campy and aggro players alike. Simply pressing down to cancel a move is just ridiculous. And don't argue that it should be done because fox can jump cancel his shine, or ness his Magnet- they choose to use their jumps for techs and if badly timed will destroy them. What you describe is a get-out-of-jail-free-card for a long duration and potent move.

Well, even if I hate his Sm4sh incarnation, at the very least he seems pretty fun to use.
At least I can have Wario-Man in all his glory.

'Ey, anyone got Wario's new SSF2BETA render on hand?
The one with his hand in the air and grabbin' his 'stache?
I need it.
For reasons.