Like spamming Shakunetsu Hadoken and SideB on ledge isn't a thing with Ryu.

There's always going to be spammers no matter the character (Fox/Falco DThrow chains, Marth's FSmash, Luffy's backthrow into anything.. you name it), and you just have to deal with getting around it or find a way to pressure the opponent enough to not give them space for cheese strategies.
Simon just happens to be the troll favorite, but that doesn't make him a bad/boring character, that's the player's own fault for being obnoxious.
And hopefully i'm not sounding like i'm just saying "git gud" with this

I don't know if this was already mentioned but you can "save" the input as long as you keep holding down the last directional key (That means, walking or dashing). It doesn't matter if you use S-tilt or dash attack, the strong special move will still come out.
I never played 4 or Ultimate so I don't know if this was a thing before. Please don't bully me if it was.

I've talked about it quite a bit in my other posts, you can also hold onto the first input then quickly do the rest of the sequence (except for Shakunetsu Hadoken, the game will think you're turning around and inputting Tatsumaki Senpukyaku)
Plus that is how you "buffer" his input moves, you do an attack and hold B while not letting go of the last directional input (if doing this out of a Special, do the inputs mid-animation instead)
And you can Input move out of shield this way too (either by quickly doing the sequence mid-dodge, or doing the inputs first and shielding afterwards)

(Also, same, i don't have Sm4sh or Ultimate, in fact the only official smash i ever played was Smash 64 and it was on emulator)


While testing for more things you can do with the "buffering" property of his input moves, i've found out Ryu can do a short pseudo-wavedash with input hadokens if you hold onto the dash button (probably works with auto-dash too)

If you do it at the edge of a platform/ledge, Ryu will also fall off of it while keeping his momentum (it's no faster than simply jumping out of dash though), but really you'll rather do it more for cancelling his Hadoken's endlag to immediately perform any action you wish


AND did you know you are allowed to turnaround on an input move? I certainly didn't.
Ryu definitely has quite a lot of potential just waiting to be uncovered, just like his friend sandbag


By the way is it just me or is Ryu's pummel -> dash re-grab an infinite?
~-~-~ Fence of Edit (roughly 7 hours after post) ~-~-~
I've discovered something: if you mash on the last direction quickly enough, it won't be "erased" as the activation for your input attack, though this isn't all that important to know but it explains why and how you can Input-Attack out of Forward Throw or even Focus cancels (by mashing the last input to dash away while still keeping the input command active).


Also, another way to make sure you input a true hadoken/shoryu instead of missinputting SideB/Tatsumaki when you're facing away from the opponent - You can double tap the first input after turning around (if it's Shoryuken, just double tap left or right, the first tap is to turn around and the second one begins the command sequence. If it's Hadoken, double tap Down after turning around. As for shakunetsu hadoken, double-tap the opposite direction of the first input or else the game will think you're doing a turnaround Tatsumaki)
though B-Reversing the moves probably saves more time than the double-tap for making sure the input comes out on the right direction

Oh, and you know how Ryu can cancel his Focus Attack's startup by double-tapping left/right, right? That "dash" animation can also be cancelled into input moves, so if you're quick with your fingers you can make some sorts of mindgames/mixups

Because mashing left/right won't cancel your input attack (at least if you do it quickly enough), this can be made slightly easier to perform by doing so

You know how Ryu can break shields easily with his strong forward tilt, right? I found out something to build extra damage after you break a shield. Shakunetsu can lock the player if they shield it normally so you can follow up with Ryu's strong f-tilt. I now possess some of CraftGMC's power!






Shakunetsu wavedash can actually make this easier so if anyone can do this starting with Shakunetsu wavedash in a match then you are a god. Also, I wonder if down-b can be infinitely cancelled into itself. I once cancelled down-b into itself and the player didn't receive any knockback, long enough for me to do a third down-b.

His focus attack (DownB) is also a shield breaker if not fully charged, though not as strong as his strong FTilt (uncharged reduces 1/3 or 1/4 of the shield, half charge reduces shield to half like jigglypuff's Pound)
And that's interesting, i never really realized that his Shakunetsu locks the player in place even when shielding

And it doesn't seem like his DownB can be chained infinitely (or at least it's extremely difficult to do so on characters with large hurtboxes) - it only stuns when at half or full charge, and a full charge Focus with dash-cancel can just barely chain into a half-charge one, which has much less hitstun
Unless it's a doubles match we're talking about...



I've also found out a way to wavedash Hadoken/Shakunetsu without buffering it from a previous attack:

Man, now i'm wishing i could also somehow record my in-game inputs so y'all can see how i'm pulling these off frame by frame

And now time to get back to bomberman's p-bomb kill% in 9 different arenas and on all characters, this is going to take all day oh boy

Well then, these places need a little bit of activity considering these characters are still new and just waiting to have techs or strategies discovered
Anyways i've found a little bit more about Ryu's input commands (no new techs, this is more like optimization):
You can just hold B indefinitely and it will always register the directional inputs, and they will always be executed on the first possible frame when you do so

With this new uh, i guess optimization for his input stuff, this made a few of his techs (or even basic stuff like light tilt/jab into true shoryu) much simpler or overall easier to perform by just simply holding down the B button at all times


The only disadvantage of this is that you cannot quite turnaround on the input attacks to correct your positioning if you're facing the wrong direction (and Tatsumaki always goes "backwards" when midair. By that i mean it always goes to the same direction you hold instead of the opposite)
Oh, and i guess random input specials if you're careless with your button mashing

So the 1.2.1 patch came out and i eventually looked at the changelogs
SideB and the input version are now different from eachother


SideB is almost unchanged - the only difference is that its speed in the air got nerfed slightly.
But now Tatsumaki Senpukyaku is better than SideB - it throws the opponent at a lower angle, deals 10.5% damage and also slightly stronger knockback (and its speed in the air is unchanged, so it's a better recovery than SideB now)


Also, i'm planning on also gathering data for Ryu much like i did for Waluigi, why not ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

i don't know where to put this joke so i'll put it at the beggining here:
wait isn't Ryu already in SSF2 why did they add him again

Anyways.. Time for another mega-dump of information, this time for Ryu (and i bet i'm forgetting something again lol)
Oh, and if the GIFs aren't loading and show just a piece of paper with a text saying "image", try opening it in a separate tab i guess

Before getting to his moveset, let's talk about his "gimmicks" or whatever you call it:
- First, his Jab-1 and Tilts have a "Light" (or "Tapped") and "Heavy" (or "Held") variations, which depends on whether you tap or hold the attack button (According to my footage, you have 2 frames until the game considers your input as "held")
- Secondly, his Specials share a similar thing - their strength or properties become different depending on how long you hold down the button
- And last but not least, his Specials have "Input" variations, where you input the original Arcade games' command sequences (Such as Forward, Down, Down-forward) and then press B to execute the respective move, which makes the Special become more powerful and/or gain different properties

I also have disabled particles and other effects (Except knockback smoke) so we all can have a better view of the range in his moves when looking at the GIFs

• Jab
Light: Already his jab is pretty unique: no matter how hard you mash, he will only ever do jab 1, and only do the full jab combo if he successfuly connects the punches (Hitting the shield does not count as a successful hit).
Unlike in the official Smash games, you cannot cancel his normals into Specials, which greatly limits his Jab from becoming one of his main forms of kill-confirm

Heavy: Only hits once, but deals 10% and has slightly stronger knockback and much longer range while still having surprisingly quick startup (but has quite a bit of endlag), i believe this would be more used as a "get off me" or to set up for quick edgeguards near the ledge

• Forward Tilt
Light: Pretty decent for starting combos/strings, and maybe for some spacing. can be used to start some aerial strings even at higher percentages (depending on DI)

Unlike in the official Smash games, his leg doesn't seem to have intangibility

Heavy: A short-ranged two-hit move that deals a total of 13% damage. The main purpose of this move is as a shield-breaker: connecting both hits can obliterate shields even when they're at full durability
If the first hit somehow misses but you still connect the second one, it will still deal immense shield damage, but won't immediately break a full shield (And if only the first hit connects, it'll deal shield damage similar to your average smash attack)

• Down Tilt
Light: Deals set knockback and is quite spammable, but deals only 2% and has very little vertical range. Very useful for extending combos, especially at higher percentages thanks to its set knockback (though you have to be quick)

Heavy: Has more range than the tapped version and stronger knockback (with low growth) while of course not being spammable, also useful for stringing into aerials or possible kill-confirms when at higher percentages

• Up Tilt
Light: Extremely spammable thanks to its speed, low knockback and vertical range, but also deals only 2% and it does not have much horizontal range compared to his other moves. along with his Down Tilt, this will be your main form of starting/extending combos and confirming kill moves, maybe even refreshing stale moves

Heavy: A somewhat strong uppercut, deals 12% and low-to-moderate knockback (KO's only at the 160%'s), has somewhat more range than his tapped up-tilt and is decent at starting juggles once it starts tumbling the opponent (comboes into several other attacks when the opponent tumbles)

Unlike in the official games, his heavy Up-Tilt also doesn't seem to have invincibility on his upper body

• Dash Attack
HOW DID I FORGET TO INCLUDE DASH ATTACK ON THE WALUIGI TOPIC AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Surprisingly quick and can KO at around 130% on ledge with no DI (but will KO around 165% with good DI) when sweetspotted (sourspot is on a late hit), The sourspot on the other hand can't KO until at extreme percentages.
Probably more useful just to set up for edgeguards at higher percentages i guess


• Forward Smash
Quite strong and has good range, able to kill around 80% on ledge if the opponent doesn't DI (115% with good DI)
But.. It misses against some opponents that are downed (or even crouching, in the case of Kirby, Game&Watch, Jiggs and a few others)

• Down Smash
Relatively quick and can hit opponents under ledge, however it deals slightly weaker knockback, KO'ing around 10% - 15% later on the ledge compared to FSmash


• Up Smash
Very quick and can kill opponents around 125% (150% if a late hit), but very lacking in horizontal range. The move seems to "sweetspot" on the first active frame, and "sourspot" when Ryu's fist is already raised



• Neutral Aerial
Like any NAir, it's a very good combo/approach tool, though it has very low base knockback.
It can also combo into itself for quite a while, plus can be followed up with a Shoryuken/Tatsumaki

• Forward Aerial
at early percentages, it's a better option than NAir early on for racking up damage, as it also chains into itself at low percentages, eventually starts to KO when around or past 120%, if it is not stale of course. (and much like NAir, can chain into Shoryuken or Tatsumaki depending on DI)
Ryu seems to have some great aerials, huh?

• Back Aerial
A relatively strong kill move, but also requires a bit of precision, as it can have trouble hitting smaller or downed opponents

• Down Aerial
A decently strong meteor smash (but still low base knockback) that sweetspots on Ryu's fist (It seems to take priority over the sourspot on his arm/shoulder too). NAir and Heavy DTilt (or even Light FTilt if the opponent DIs in instead of away) are likely your best options to confirm this move.

The sourspot seems to be located on his shoulder, and it's very weak and instead sends the opponent upwards.
DAir's hitboxes also don't seem to stay active for long at all.

• Up Aerial
A two hit uppercut-like punch that deals a total of 12%, good for keeping the opponent in the air and for stringing into Shoryuken depending on DI.
The knockback angle is kind of weird in my opinion, depending on DI, it either throws the opponent almost straight upwards, or directly behind Ryu



• Grab & Throws
Of course, can't really "talk" all that much about his grab & throws, so instead have his approximate grab range

And then his throws with the "best" and "worst" DI for the opponent to survive, along with no DI of course



• Special Moves
Before we get into detail with his specials, let's show some general things:
We already know his Specials have "Input" versions (except DownB), which are much stronger and/or have different properties from the B specials.
You can "store" the input attacks by doing the directional inputs and holding onto the final direction, and it will be executed once you eventually press B (You can mash the last input, and it will still come out as intended, IF you can mash quickly enough)
This also allows you to perform Input Attacks out-of-shield.

Alternatively, you can "buffer" the input to be executed on the first frame possible by doing this the other way around: you hold B and do the directional inputs. this is most useful during combos or to perform specific techs (such as Pseudo-Wavedashing with Hadoken, which will be shown later on)



• Neutral Special (Hadoken)
General info: If tapped, Hadoken will linger onscreen for a long time, but also travel very slowly. If held, it will instead move much quicker, but have a shorter lifetime. This means that tapping or holding will do very little to really change the range of the projectiles (Though holding does still slightly increase the range)

If you have Auto-Dash or use a Dash Button, you can pseudo-wavedash with input hadokens by buffering them from a previous move, or holding B then doing the input sequence
Additionally, if you slide off a ledge/platform after an Input Hadoken, you get to skip the endlag


Hadoken/True Hadoken: Deals 6% (8% if True Hadoken) and has very weak knockback, so the best use of this would be for accumulating damage and pressuring/covering the opponent's movement options


Shakunetsu Hadoken: Deals 11% damage and has moderately low knockback, the projectile multihits and has high hitstun, preventing the opponent from doing anything (other than SDI) even when shielding, allowing this move to be a combo starter, kill confirm, or even combo extender


• Down Special (Focus Attack)
Ryu will stand in place (or float mid-air) and focus for a moment before punching forward, during the entirety of the "focusing" animation, Ryu gains super armor, but this only gets applied for one hit (meaning multihits or quick attacks will easily break through it)
An important thing to be aware of is that he immediately loses super armor when punching, probably as soon as frame 1
Another thing i've found out is that uncharged focus attack has a slightly bigger hitbox than if it were charged

When uncharged the move acts like a normal attack and deals knockback (with a small amount of shield damage).
When partially charged, it will stun the opponent in place, allowing you to confirm a variety of attacks, if the opponent blocks, it will deal shield damage similar to jigglypuff's Pound.
When fully charged, the stun effect lasts much longer and the move completely ignores shields
If the opponent instead gets hit mid-air, the move will behave like a normal move and only deal knockback, but still deal very high hitstun before the opponent is launched

One thing you need to know, is that this move can be cancelled during the charge or after a successful hit (If you whiff, you cannot cancel the endlag), but unlike typical cancellable "charge" attacks, you don't press shield to cancel it, but rather double-tap left or right. This makes Ryu take a quick step backward/forward. Couple this with the fact that Ryu gains slow falling and "floats" to whatever direction you're going, and you have a rather decent recovery move
The most awesome thing however, is that this is one of, if not the only move that can be "special cancelled", because during the double-tap dash, it can instantly be cancelled into any special moves (other than another Focus Attack). If you're frame perfect you can even land a True Shoryuken out of an uncharged focus attack.


• Side Special (Tatsumaki Senpukyaku)
You can tap or hold the special button to control the distance (except on air) Ryu travels. the move also grants slow falling and some horizontal recovery ^{(travels slightly further if input)} without putting him on helplessness (can only be used once until landing on the ground or getting hit though). It also has less endlag when the move finishes mid-air
Not only that, the move also protects Ryu from incoming projectiles (but not very strong ones such as Samus' charge shot or 115% Lucario's aura sphere). Input version can deal with slightly stronger projectiles.
Careful about the spacing though, only Ryu's legs have hitboxes, not his upper body

As an attack, it deals 9% ^{(or 11% if Input)} and moderate knockback ^{(slightly stronger knockback and lower angle if Input)}, and because it doesn't put Ryu in helplessness, this move can be used to send the opponent to the blast zone ^{(if input)} when offstage, or to combo into Shoryuken ^{(if SideB)}


• Up Special (Shoryuken)
Ah, saving the best for last, here we go i suppose, let's start with probably the most important bit of information:
UpB Shoryuken is much, much weaker than the Input Shoryuken, in fact Input Shoryuken is practically twice as powerful in knockback growth

Shoryuken also loses a bit of its kill power if you do it mid-air instead of on ground, though it's not quite noticeable so it's not like it even matters

If you space Shoryuken so that he perfectly lands onto a platform (or on the ledge during recovery), you get to skip the landing lag too

Until the end, until this forum needs a perfect way to finishing.