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gEmssbguy13
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:56 pm Posts: 458 Location: In the EST Zone, somewhere eating chips Country:
Gender: Male
MGN Username: gEmssbguy13
Currently Playing: Smash Bros, FNaF, Undertale, GMod, Delver, Xenoblade, ect...
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EDIT: Ugh, sorry for the miscommunication. I was trying to say that taking away Dancing Blade's options would take away Marth's only good priority move (besides Dolphin Slash of course). I honestly believe it's the only real outstanding move. While yeah it could use a nerf, I like it a lot this way. His combo game is fine, I just thought his range was so short it you can't combo as well. Then I remembered the rest of the cast has sorter range too, it's no big problem. I keep forgetting that his moveset is so different from the official games (which is where most of my time has been lately).
Again, sorry. I can be an idiot at times.
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Last edited by gEmssbguy13 on Sun Jan 11, 2015 2:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Sat Jan 10, 2015 11:07 pm |
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Starkiller
SSF2 Developer
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:47 pm Posts: 2316 Location: BC Country:
Gender: Male
Currently Playing: Complacency breeds weakness. My opponents won't stop getting stronger, neither will I.
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 |  |  |  | gEmssbguy13 wrote: HONESTLY, I believe we could nerf Dancing Blade and Dolphin Slash, but it would literally take away his combo game through these alone.Think about it, you can't easily do fair combo's like in Melee or Brawl because his range is comparable to Ganondorf's in Brawl. Plus his frame is huge and he's light. So this makes him a faster, weaker, and lighter Ganondorf. The worst part is that with his range being so much shorter, he literally has no real advantage against these other characters besides grabs and his Dancing Blade. I mean, be honest, when was the last time you landed like 5 fairs in a row on someone that wasn't DK? It doesn't happen. Ya know why? It's a combination of being short ranged, and having weird ground-to-air transitions. No, now we have to work with Dancing Blade because it's like his only good tool. Kinda like Link and his Boomerangs or Mega Man's Mega Buster prior to his nerf. Not only did this take away his amazing spacing game, it took alot of safe options he had too. Sure his animations were sped up and he still has good range in comparison to most of the cast, but not alot of options are safe anymore. That is except Dancing Blade. It's fast and can be spammed for pretty much as long as ya like if you space it right. So yeah, it Ichigo all over again Dolphin Slash needs nerfed, I agree. Ether a priority nerf or give it some ending lag. You can literally Dolphin Slash people for days without being punished because the time window to actually punish him is so darn small. |  |  |  |  |
Wait, are you saying Ganondorf's range is bad in Brawl? I'm assuming that because long range would mean you could land the hits = combo, and short range means you can't land the hits... Anyways, just gonna say that Ganondorf's fair is longer than Marth's fsmash in Brawl. His range was only "bad" because he was so slow it didn't matter that his moves were huge. DS just needs landlag (make it risky), and DB needs hitlag so that it can be SDI'd. Maybe slower, but not by much if at all. Nobody seems to talk about how short Marth's dtilt is in this game. That was huge for him in past games, maybe too big for his own good but it really helped his ground game.
_________________Men that are trapped by the chains of "maybe" can never reach their dreams! The weak are washed away by the tides of fate. The strong drink it up. No matter the man, we all wear masks. Whether it be over our faces or over our hearts.Youtube: NinjaLobsterStudios Stream: twitch.tv/ninjalobster
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Sat Jan 10, 2015 11:53 pm |
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goml
BR Member
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2014 12:22 pm Posts: 1448
Gender: Female
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Marth's Dtilt is still pretty great
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Sun Jan 11, 2015 2:03 am |
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Starkiller
SSF2 Developer
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:47 pm Posts: 2316 Location: BC Country:
Gender: Male
Currently Playing: Complacency breeds weakness. My opponents won't stop getting stronger, neither will I.
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It feels like it *should* go further than it does. Knock back and trajectory are all great
_________________Men that are trapped by the chains of "maybe" can never reach their dreams! The weak are washed away by the tides of fate. The strong drink it up. No matter the man, we all wear masks. Whether it be over our faces or over our hearts.Youtube: NinjaLobsterStudios Stream: twitch.tv/ninjalobster
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Sun Jan 11, 2015 3:24 am |
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Jammy
BR Member
Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:08 am Posts: 888 Country:
Gender: Male
MGN Username: Jammy
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 |  |  |  | gEmssbguy13 wrote: HONESTLY, I believe we could nerf Dancing Blade and Dolphin Slash, but it would literally take away his combo game through these alone.Think about it, you can't easily do fair combo's like in Melee or Brawl because his range is comparable to Ganondorf's in Brawl. Plus his frame is huge and he's light. So this makes him a faster, weaker, and lighter Ganondorf. The worst part is that with his range being so much shorter, he literally has no real advantage against these other characters besides grabs and his Dancing Blade. I mean, be honest, when was the last time you landed like 5 fairs in a row on someone that wasn't DK? It doesn't happen. Ya know why? It's a combination of being short ranged, and having weird ground-to-air transitions. No, now we have to work with Dancing Blade because it's like his only good tool. Kinda like Link and his Boomerangs or Mega Man's Mega Buster prior to his nerf. Not only did this take away his amazing spacing game, it took alot of safe options he had too. Sure his animations were sped up and he still has good range in comparison to most of the cast, but not alot of options are safe anymore. That is except Dancing Blade. It's fast and can be spammed for pretty much as long as ya like if you space it right. So yeah, it Ichigo all over again Dolphin Slash needs nerfed, I agree. Ether a priority nerf or give it some ending lag. You can literally Dolphin Slash people for days without being punished because the time window to actually punish him is so darn small. |  |  |  |  |
1: Really don't know how the nerf would take away from his combo game, which is mostly built around all of his fair, uair, nair, grabs and utilt. Dancing blade is useful for starting combos by getting a juggle going or confirming a grab, but I wouldn't say it's instrumental in his combos. As for dolphin slash, it's a situational and weak combo finisher at best. It's most useful as a combo breaker. 2: No idea how you can compare him to Brawl Ganondorf, he is completely different. Fair combos are easily achievable, even against lighter characters, you need to mix it up with other moves such as utilt and uair to continue the juggle. 3: When have you ever seen someone use 5 hits of fair in a row? This doesn't even happen in melee lol. Marth doesn't just have one move, he has to mix his combos up with other moves, just like any character. 4: Marth isn't short ranged, he has a range advantage over much of the cast, especially since most of his moves are disjointed. This, coupled with his great dash speed, makes his spacing good. Not sure how you can say his spacing game was taken away. Really can't agree with anything you said here. Not sure where you're getting your ideas from.
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Sun Jan 11, 2015 6:00 am |
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TheCodeSamurai
BR Member
Joined: Sat Mar 22, 2014 2:14 pm Posts: 2075 Country:
Gender: Anime Girl
Currently Playing: SSF2, MGS 3, Melee, Project M
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What about nerfing DS and DB stops me from doing uthrows -> utilts -> uairs -> fairs -> dair or tipper?
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Sun Jan 11, 2015 1:19 pm |
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RemPrower
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:01 pm Posts: 530 Country:
Gender: Male
MGN Username: ZekePrower
Currently Playing: With my fox dolls.
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I don't think those other attacks need nerfing. What makes those so unfair that they need to be reduced in usefulness?
When I first used Marth, I was winning fights using dolphin slash only. The devs, as far as I've heard, don't want a character to be built on using a single move to win all of his/her fights. DS is a damage dealer, tipper, kill move, fast acting and low penalty attack that can beat this game for you. That's just not appropriate. I don't know what to say about dancing blade though because I don't really understand it.
The other attacks all have the same problem though: openings. If you miss, I'll hit you, period.
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Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:03 pm |
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Kyo Tanaka
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 7:51 pm Posts: 159
Gender: Anime Girl
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Pretty sure that move has a set knockback, or it's so low it can be used over and over again for simple harassment. You can't DI out of it from what I hear as well. If you're a melee character, you're gonna have a hard time getting in a Marth that spams upb unless you force him to miss you, while being in that range the same time. If you aren't, he's ready to do another.
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Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:13 pm |
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sparty88
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 12:30 am Posts: 510 Location: Michigan Country:
Gender: Male
MGN Username: sparty88
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I use side B extremely rarely and randomly with the intent of either hitting the first two and canceling into something else (fsmash, utilit or dtilt) or not getting to you until the very end of it. But as an offensive weapon, I honestly use it once or twice in an entire match, sometimes never. And using dolphin slash as anything but a recovery/combo finisher is scrubby, and I'd rather lose than look scrubby.
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Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:51 pm |
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Zapperrix
BR Member
Joined: Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:37 pm Posts: 2283
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MGN Username: Zapperrix
Skype: dat_zapp
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So using it as an OoS option is scrubby? Last time I checked, people (including pros) do that in Melee.
Sure it's a little too safe as an OoS option atm due to no end lad, but that's not scrubby honestly.
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Tue Jan 13, 2015 3:38 pm |
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sparty88
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 12:30 am Posts: 510 Location: Michigan Country:
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MGN Username: sparty88
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Considering what Marth can do with a grab or utilt, wouldn't that only be a best option against Fox?
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Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:37 pm |
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Jammy
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upB has more range & less startup, meaning it's good against pretty much any character pressuring your shield. a shield grab is a lot slower and has less range. don't think utilt is a viable oos option as you would need to drop your shield first.
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Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:50 pm |
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goml
BR Member
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2014 12:22 pm Posts: 1448
Gender: Female
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The best OoS option is Alt f4
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Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:55 pm |
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gEmssbguy13
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:56 pm Posts: 458 Location: In the EST Zone, somewhere eating chips Country:
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MGN Username: gEmssbguy13
Currently Playing: Smash Bros, FNaF, Undertale, GMod, Delver, Xenoblade, ect...
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Gotta love them Melee shield physics. Jammy's right though, utilt is more of an anti air now. Dolphin Slash is far more superb than up tilt will ever be.
_________________ Treat others as you want to be treated, that is the Golden Rule...
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Tue Jan 13, 2015 5:08 pm |
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sparty88
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 12:30 am Posts: 510 Location: Michigan Country:
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MGN Username: sparty88
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OoS wise, sure. But utilt is far more valuable than dolphin slash.
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Tue Jan 13, 2015 7:14 pm |
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