People were more used to the more fast-paced gameplay of 9b. Beta is more like Sm4sh than 9b in that there is more emphasis on grab game, along with overall campier gameplay. In my opinion, Isaac sums up Beta's fundamentals (grab game, camping, having trouble killing, less emphasis on offstage). Beta also has less disjoints if I'm not mistaken. Some people don't want these changes and see them as a bad thing. I personally am not too fond of these changes, as they've affected Kirby for the worse (Worse air game, less disjoints), and I'm not very fond of grabs being as centralized in the neutral as they are in Sm4sh and as they've become now. 9b was more similar to Melee, but now it seems Beta's lingering in the middle, sort of throwing off the balance that SSF2 had and the audience it appealed to.

Harr, to answer your question, I think in order to remedy the complaints, one would either have to make grabs worse overall, add more disjoints, and make sure every character has at least three solid kill options and at least two gimping/edgeguarding options. I think Beta controls much more smoothly than 9b (except for the priority of the buffering system; I think jumping should always be max priority in the buffering system), and it has potential to be better than 9b ever was, but as of now, it's not, due to the larger gap between high tiers and low tiers and the slower, "more methodical and chesslike" gameplay. If people wanted Sm4sh, they'd play Sm4sh. People want SSF2.

9b was praised in comparison to Beta.

Even though this isn't SSF2 Final, it's still supposed to be a later version, so it's a disappointment that it's gotten worse rather than better. Even for an unfinished project, taking a huge step backward just doesn't make sense.

HFF's summed it up. It's not even unique anymore. It feels like Smash 4. And considering Smash 4 is on life support, that's not a good thing.

I disagree with those last 2 sentiments there, and the overall grim depiction that some are passing on a whole.

It's too early to make such a declaration and people need to chill because the game was slowed a tad for readability and accessibility, especially for lower tiers to be able to actually move up. It still feels plenty fast and "Melee-y". Very few things are Sm4sh AT ALL. To state otherwise demonstrates a rather small view of what makes Sm4sh... well Sm4sh

You're right. Sm4sh has good stuff like Master Hand's theme on FD.

DEVS WHY

WHY ISN'T MASTER HAND'S THEME ON FD
THIS IS BASIC s*** IF YOU'RE GONNA NERF THE META, LET US SEE OUR BUFFED MUSIC

Has anyone else noticed that a lot of projectiles in beta have tons of priority? Maybe I'm just not landing the right moves, but things like Mario's fireballs and Goku's ki blast use to have super low priority. Like, any move in the game could destroy them. Now you get stuff like swarms of Luigi's fireballs coming at you, and it feels super difficult to deal with.

Seems like projectiles actually can't be destroyed by non-projectile hitboxes. One exception is that Marth can clank with Isaac's sideB, but that move is wonky, and it might be because Marth is hitting Isaac through the move. Same with Ichigo's projectile. It kinda feels like ZSS's sideB disjoint bug in 9b.

It's called "transcendency" and basically projectiles exist on another plane that can't be attacked.

Which is actually a really bad thing.

Most of my arguments, I'm speaking for my friends' opinions, but THIS is a fatal flaw that even I'VE noticed firsthand.

Yeah, f*** Transcendency. It's worse than any of 9b's jank. Hell, it's worse than 9b's priority system. f*** Transcendency. Worst part about Beta by far.

Just for the record, projectiles arent actually transcendant. They are the way they are because of trading being disabled, and the projectile hitbox always outboxing "regular" attacks so to speak. Or at least thats what TSON told me. Im assuming that once trades are fixed, projectiles are not uber dumb anymore

I hope want Skylar said is true. Having to deal with waves of Mario's fireballs is just ridiculous.

Yeah the speed that they come out of is crazy along with his Ngame it's always a big challenge for me to over come that. lol

Mario in general is just crazy good in beta. also, i'm pretty sure that he can confirm fireballs into up-smash in some situations and there were also a lot of times I tried to get in on the dude, especially in the air, and the fireballs would cancel my ATK before I got to do anything.

Im'ma say it again:

20% damage for each of his Smash attacks.


Now, while his damage is really on 3-4% above what Dr. Mario's output on his Smashes, Mario's easy confirm into his Smash attacks make it really easy to abuse that extra damage. Damage decay being makes a dent when he already do well above average damage. Why go for full combo-punishes with the risk of execution error/DI changes, but you can land three short strings like Nair > Usmash (32%), or Fair > Dsmash (37%) to get your opponent to 90%+, not counting the Fireball damage racking up from you zoning for an opening.

I've had someone quit on me because they got hit only 4 times on a fresh stock, and realized they already have taken 61%