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Black Mage 
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Welfare Wednesday wrote:
So I've noticed that Death will knock someone out of your grab, and the grab will cease to do any damage while whatever throw you were doing still carries out the animation.

So my original thought was to have death not knock people out of your throws.
But then I tested something out with multiple characters at once, and I realized.
All those fancy throw animations? They dont have hitboxes.

So here's an idea, stuff like fthrow and bthrow, why not make them connect with characters not caught in a throw, with actual hitboxes? It wont be game breaking, but will give him some real good potential in teams and free-for-alls and combo potential with Death, along with not leaving you a sitting duck when someone gets knocked out of a throw. This gives BM a unique twist on his throw game, a situational yet fun buff. (BM caught someone in a throw? The rest of you better back the hell away or youll end up flying the same way that unlucky soul will)

This screams "Crowd Control" which was one of the main things Black Mage was used for in FF. Collateral damage and black magic go hand and hand so why not?


Hm... I like that concept, and it doesn't really break BM on singles or anything, so it doesn't need a nerf onto other area.

But what I really want ATM is that Stop bug, it hurts my soul

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Fri Dec 12, 2014 12:59 pm
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Yeah his throws dont need a nerf at all in any area.

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Fri Dec 12, 2014 1:19 pm
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Nair Sheild poking, really... ?

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Sun Jan 11, 2015 2:19 am
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Well, after some time researching I came to the conclusion that, in all honesty, if BM needs a nerf into something, is on his NAir, it's ridiculous right now.

It deals 19% damage, the hitbox is kinda big, it's extremely hard to SDI, it has awesome priority, auto-cancels in ground to some secured attacks (UTilt, which can lead into ANOTHER Nair), it lasts forever and destroys shield (If the attack hits entirely it can actually pass a full HP Shield)

I don't want the move to be destroyed, homewer so in my opinion they should make it less reliable on everything: Reducing the priority and making the first hits have more knockback so you can't actually escape SDI'ing, and removing a little bit of the damage so it doesn't punish shields.

If you take out these things I feel like the move would still be a good option, but not as stupidly powerful as it is right now.

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Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:27 am
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The main thing with nair is that it has poor range, so it really can't be spammed. I would support reducing the priority and shield damage, but I like the landing lag the way it is because you can do fun pillar combos which is a unique aspect of BM.

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Mon Jan 12, 2015 11:36 am
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TheCodeSamurai wrote:
The main thing with nair is that it has poor range, so it really can't be spammed. I would support reducing the priority and shield damage, but I like the landing lag the way it is because you can do fun pillar combos which is a unique aspect of BM.


Yeah, it's still a little bit too much right now.

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Mon Jan 12, 2015 1:08 pm
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WelfareWednesday wrote:
So I've noticed that Death will knock someone out of your grab, and the grab will cease to do any damage while whatever throw you were doing still carries out the animation.

So my original thought was to have death not knock people out of your throws.
But then I tested something out with multiple characters at once, and I realized.
All those fancy throw animations? They dont have hitboxes.

So here's an idea, stuff like fthrow and bthrow, why not make them connect with characters not caught in a throw, with actual hitboxes? It wont be game breaking, but will give him some real good potential in teams and free-for-alls and combo potential with Death, along with not leaving you a sitting duck when someone gets knocked out of a throw. This gives BM a unique twist on his throw game, a situational yet fun buff. (BM caught someone in a throw? The rest of you better back the hell away or youll end up flying the same way that unlucky soul will)

This screams "Crowd Control" which was one of the main things Black Mage was used for in FF. Collateral damage and black magic go hand and hand so why not?


Best idea since adding Goku.

Seriously, this is genius. I love it!

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Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:39 pm
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It's an interesting Idea to say the least o.o

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Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:07 pm
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Don't throws have hitboxes in the main games? (They do in PM, but I'm not sure about the rest)

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Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:46 pm

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Yes they do.

In which, Fedora makes a really good point to that throw hit-boxes should hit passerby characters who get too close.

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Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:48 pm
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Tails' fthrow he could throw players at other players like projectiles. That would be hilarious to say the least. With BM it wouldn't be funny, but it works.

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Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:52 pm

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Pretty sure the actual throws don't hit anyone in the main game, but actually the knockback of the thrown person does. Though I really haven't played much FFA or teams to actually see throws hitting people.

I'm with buffing BM's throws. Isn't his role in the game to support? This improves his team game as well from paper.


Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:18 pm
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I know the players themselves aren't hitboxes. I just thought that would be a pretty awesome, and pretty darn original mechanic to implement. It would probably be too much work to do, but it would be hella creative.

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Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:21 pm
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RemPrower wrote:
I know the players themselves aren't hitboxes. I just thought that would be a pretty awesome, and pretty darn original mechanic to implement. It would probably be too much work to do, but it would be hella creative.


It would, it's so original it could work.

Probably be the bane of teams though.

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Tue Jan 13, 2015 5:17 pm
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RemPrower wrote:
I know the players themselves aren't hitboxes. I just thought that would be a pretty awesome, and pretty darn original mechanic to implement. It would probably be too much work to do, but it would be hella creative.
I don't quite understand your phrasing, but you can indeed throw characters into other characters to deal damage and knockback in Melee.

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Tue Jan 13, 2015 5:34 pm
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