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Black Mage 
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Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2014 1:18 am
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Black Mage is still a great fighter, but the Thundaga and Meteor spells are horrid now.
Thundaga will only reflect off of obstacles such as walls when it encounters them from the left side. And you cannot re-caste it while one is still flying around.
Meteor does not scale to the size of Black Mage, and will commonly lose it's size if Black Mage touches the ground while it was charging in the air.
Not to mention Black Mage sometimes drops it(the attack cancels and floats up and out of the game)
And Wild Encounter, the Flare spell does not damage other players anymore, which kinda sucks :(

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Fri Aug 08, 2014 6:24 pm
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MaskofTruth wrote:
Black Mage is still a great fighter, but the Thundaga and Meteor spells are horrid now.
Thundaga will only reflect off of obstacles such as walls when it encounters them from the left side. And you cannot re-caste it while one is still flying around.
Meteor does not scale to the size of Black Mage, and will commonly lose it's size if Black Mage touches the ground while it was charging in the air.
Not to mention Black Mage sometimes drops it(the attack cancels and floats up and out of the game)
And Wild Encounter, the Flare spell does not damage other players anymore, which kinda sucks :(


Almost all of those are bugs they will probably fix soon. :)

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Fri Aug 08, 2014 6:27 pm

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A few thoughts after playing him more:

Kill moves-
Upsmash- probably my favorite. Seems to kill about 120ish(uncharged) on average characters, and 90-100ish on lightweights. Decently easy to combo into as well from things like low level stops or short hop dair. Helps that off the top kills net you a full stop charge(which while risky is still a significant threat, usually leading to at least 40+ damage). Also helps that you can do it out of a dash(and is almost always better than his dash attack from my experience).

Fair- At around 90-100 you can use this to edge guard for kills. Not much more to say. Bair is similar(but seems weaker).

Dair- It's still somewhat tricky to use, but thanks to BM's recovery I find a lot of my stocks coming from this move. Netting the sweetspot just gives so much advantage. Of note, it is possible to get a short hop death if the opponent is lying down and you approach them backwards. Not super useful, but the more you know sort of thing.

Uair- seems to start working at around 130. Not a great option, but still worth remembering.

Fsmash- It's not great at killing, but it is a pretty decent ledge guard move thanks to the hitbox. I don't like throwing it out in neutral/mid level situations though, as I feel ftilt is vastly safer and accomplishes much of the same(getting them near the edge). Really doesn't even seem to kill at 120ish if they DI well.

Meteor- Doesn't often kill straight up, but the ability to just screw their recovery is another major way to get stocks off.

Throws-
Really seems like the throw game is basically
"Do I want them off the edge because I think I can fair/gimp them?"- appropriate forward/back

Otherwise Dthrow. You can get so much out of it, and up throw almost never seems to lead to similar reward.

Stop- I've found some use for it as i've played more. It's hard to judge vs players who can react better, but I do think it's got some utility as a punish and a "all around" option, especially while falling. Mostly it's a nice way to set up easy upsmashes at lethal, or a great way to start a new stock with a fsmash combo after a full charge(usually from an off the top kill).

I still think dash attack is mostly a matchup thing(as dash grab, upsmash, or short hop seem almost always better). Maybe it's a decent "out of stop" kill move at some %.

Downsmash is still completely worthless charged or uncharged in my experience, charged fsmash is only in stop combo's, and charged upsmash has only ever been used to be flashy(and once on an awkward death setup that probably doesn't work on humans).


Fri Aug 08, 2014 7:46 pm
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Does BM (lol) still have a viable Ken Combo?

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Fri Aug 08, 2014 8:33 pm

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DrunkenRockman wrote:
Does BM (lol) still have a viable Ken Combo?


BM can use Dair (with death affliction), then Haste for a near guarantee kill when near an edge.

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Fri Aug 08, 2014 9:01 pm
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It can be meteor canceled

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Fri Aug 08, 2014 11:42 pm
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I noticed that you can intentionally force Black Mage's down special (meteor) to continue rising instead of dropping. Does anyone know exactly how this is done?

I believe it has something to do with interrupting Black Mage while he's using it without letting go of special. Sometimes I can roll after landing and it will prevent the meteor from dropping. Another time I noticed it is by using Meteor right before hitting the ground and then mashing the other direction. Sometimes two meteors will rise.

Check out this video:
YouTube Video:


Sun Aug 10, 2014 6:25 pm
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Zimpery wrote:
I noticed that you can intentionally force Black Mage's down special (meteor) to continue rising instead of dropping. Does anyone know exactly how this is done?

I believe it has something to do with interrupting Black Mage while he's using it without letting go of special. Sometimes I can roll after landing and it will prevent the meteor from dropping. Another time I noticed it is by using Meteor right before hitting the ground and then mashing the other direction. Sometimes two meteors will rise.

Check out this video:
[ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9YoVYgLxhE ]


I think I read somewhere that if you start the move RIGHT when you land that happens. Not sure what use you'd have for it but there ya go

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Sun Aug 10, 2014 6:47 pm
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Huey wrote:
I think I read somewhere that if you start the move RIGHT when you land that happens. Not sure what use you'd have for it but there ya go


I just discovered that you can easily get this to work while still in the air. Simply use the move and then fast-fall about half a second later. (When the meteor would normally start rising.) This is odd because the meteor actually doesn't rise if Black Mage is is in mid-air.

Edit: I can no longer perform the above method for some reason.

Also there are definitely more ways to do this.
YouTube Video:

Pay attention to the last meteor especially. I feel that if someone could do this reliably it could be useful.


Sun Aug 10, 2014 7:29 pm
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Where do you guys feel like BM is on the tier list? I think he gets dominated by the best characters in the game, but he has pros which put him in mid-high or mid tier level

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Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:23 pm
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TheCodeSamurai wrote:
Where do you guys feel like BM is on the tier list? I think he gets dominated by the best characters in the game, but he has pros which put him in mid-high or mid tier level


I'm bringing black mage straight to the top! #1! You'll see! You'll all see!

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Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:29 am
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I gotta admit, I didn't like BM at first. But now, he's grown on me; his aerials are really good, despite the nerfs to his Thundaga, Haste, and Meteor.

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Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:46 am
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I just noticed you can control the trajectory of Meteor. By holding the respective button you can make the meteor's trajectory go either normally (Holding no buttons), a more downward angle (Holding the button opposite to the direction you're facing), and a more horizontal angle (holding the button to the direction you're facing).

I think pretty much Black Mage's worst fear in terms of MU's at the moment would be Jigglypuff. Though i can't really justify at the moment.

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Tue Aug 12, 2014 5:57 am
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Yellokirbyguy wrote:
I just noticed you can control the trajectory of Meteor. By holding the respective button you can make the meteor's trajectory go either normally (Holding no buttons), a more downward angle (Holding the button opposite to the direction you're facing), and a more horizontal angle (holding the button to the direction you're facing).

I think pretty much Black Mage's worst fear in terms of MU's at the moment would be Jigglypuff. Though i can't really justify at the moment.


The only matchups I have trouble with are heavy hitters because of BM's weight. Other than that, everyone is susceptible to Stop, which is really good when you learn to abuse it. It pretty much makes all matchups the same to me.

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Wed Aug 13, 2014 1:59 am
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Huey wrote:
Yellokirbyguy wrote:
I just noticed you can control the trajectory of Meteor. By holding the respective button you can make the meteor's trajectory go either normally (Holding no buttons), a more downward angle (Holding the button opposite to the direction you're facing), and a more horizontal angle (holding the button to the direction you're facing).

I think pretty much Black Mage's worst fear in terms of MU's at the moment would be Jigglypuff. Though i can't really justify at the moment.


The only matchups I have trouble with are heavy hitters because of BM's weight. Other than that, everyone is susceptible to Stop, which is really good when you learn to abuse it. It pretty much makes all matchups the same to me.


Hrmm, i always charge up Stop during Enemy respawn, but i always forget to use it. Maybe that will change when i use Black Mage online. Though in my opinion, Stop should be used as a not-so-secret weapon, the opponent knows it's coming, but when? Because if you get a habit of using Stop in particular situations, good players will note that and use it to easily punish you once they learn when and where you normally use it (For example, using Stop as an edgeguarding tactic). It is good however to use on shields, I'll give ya that.

Oh by the way, Wooden staff (A.K.A F-tilt) is too damn good

YouTube Video:


Seriously though, this thing can easily shut down combo's and it's a better edgeguarding tool than Thundaga if you know how to use it correctly.

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Chopper wrote:
And then there was Trainer James. Little Jim was the only one in the bike gang...who had to use training wheels.

School's getting a bit more important, so i'll be on less frequently due to this.


3ds Friend code~ 4210-4750-3059
Pm me if you've added me so i can add ya back please


Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:59 am
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