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McLeodGaming Mafia XIV [Cowboys vs Cattlerustlers] 
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Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 8:36 am
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I very much apologize for my absence in this. We are finishing up my s**** finally, and my computer had to be unplugged for 2 days. I should be able to post more regularly now. Now that I look at everything, a lot of people have had problems with being active. What a coincidence. So anyways, I believe I was asked to contribute more to the scum-hunting, and I look pretty scummy because of my fault of relating Skype and Forum Mafia to closely with my opinion of Day 1 lynching. Now, since Lightning and a couple others have asked for reads, I will give reads that I find to be outstanding/important. Anybody not mentioned in this list have either not said enough/has not given me any opinion of them.

Scum Vibes:
1. Panthera Leo - Since the beginning of the game, he's been a popular point of discussion... and has good reason to be. He immediately fought against the random voting at the beginning, associating it with random lynching and how bad it was. However, I didn't feel any scum vibes until his many clashes with Brik. Panthera acted extremely defensive, and made a great deal of inaccurate accusations. The scum is strong with this one. (In my opinion anyways.)

2. JamesClyde - His first few posts were question after question. When his question was answered, he immediately asked another question, whether it be changing the topic or switching the target of another question. Then after his barrage of questions to a few players, he went into defense mode and clashed with 2 or 3 people that had voted against him. I smell soap scum.

3. King Arthur - He hopped on the JamesClyde Bandwagon early on, using TWOK as his reasoning. He also made posts against Panthera. These 2, (oh hey, my other 2 scum vibers) feel to me like the most poked and prodded.

4. Ramsey - He feels a bit scummy in my book, but he's not that far from neutral.

Town Vibes:
1. Brik - This guy radiates so many town vibes that it hurts to look at him or his posts directly.From post 1, this guy worked for the town and only for the town. Post after post he totally destroyed/put down ANYTHING Panthera Leo said, showing clear motives of wanting to help the town and steer it in the right direction. If Panthera was some evil wizard, Brik would be a knight in shining armor riding in on a white horse to storm his castle and return peace to the lands. SO MUCH TOWN IT'S LIKE HE'S STANDING IN FRONT OF THE SUN.

2. TOWK - This guy has been really town-oriented since the beginning of the game, like Brik. But Brik being the gigantic symbol of all this is town that he is has outshined him. He was one of the people that objected to my bad idea of no scum-hunting for day 1. (This was a horrible idea and I never should have said that.) He also helped against Panthera and has pushed people to give their opinions on things.

3. Terra - Has good intentions toward the town and has made numerous arguments against things. Has repeatedly shown reads, which is nice.

Yeah the rest of you are pretty neutral in this.

On another note: Throughout my various readings and re-readings of the posts, I have come to realize something: YOUR POSTS. ARE HUGE. SO. MUCH. STUFF.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:39 am
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Unvote

Leave him as L-2, until he claims, remember , this is a big setup with 2 scum parties, we dont know what shenanigans it has.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 1:19 am
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My reads: show
King Arthur:Scummy
*I have already written arguments against him
194:Null, leaning towards scum
*I have already written arguments against him
Ramsey:Scummy
*I have already written arguments against him
Brik:Townish
His arguments are backed up by solid evidence, and he spots contradictions fairly easily in other people's posts. He has helped to move the town forward.
Lightning:Null, leaning towards town
Lightning did not really suspect anyone, or put pressure on people to gather information. In addition to that, he did not say anything about Panthera's arguments. However, he has helped the town move forward a bit from his reads.
TheOneWhoKnocks:Null
Has had some scummy posts, and some townish posts. Null.
Dephius:Townish
His arguments have evidence in them, and his reaction tests helped with the reads on Panthera. Townish.
Blood:Scummy
His accusations against me make no sense. He accused me of insulting Felipe's language, which I did not do. He was using atrocious wording in his posts, (eg:stupid, retarded). And Felipe did not say more than most of the people who voted for Pathera. For example. Dephius gave a fairly reasonable explanation as to why he voted for Pathera. What was Felipe's explanation? 'He is waaaaaaaaay scummy' Also, my read on Felipe was also based on him 'lurking', but as soon as 194 told me that he wasn't and he told us that he was on holiday, I moved him off my scum list. That doesn't mean that he can't be leaning towards scum, now does it?
Terra:Townish
He has been giving a lot of reads, and questioning people's arguments fairly well.
kyuubit:Null, leaning towards town
Has been helping the town a bit, giving reaction tests every now and then.
Bonsaitoad:Null, leaning towards scum
Has not been helping the town that much. I sense lurking, because, for some reason, he only has posted three times up until now.
Felipe:Null, leaning towards scum
I have not played any games with him yet, as this is my first with him inside, so I have yet to understand his logic yet. However, his only 'slightly scum read' that he has on me is that I 'jump on too many people'. I have said it before, and I shall say it once again. I only object to their arguments, with walls of text. Maybe that's why you think that I 'jump on too many people'.
Mr.Shoop:Scummy
He has only posted irrelevant stuff, and has tried to convince us to No-lynch. He also says that he does not want to vote Cactus. Why? We have yet to find out. He also calls Ramsey only a 'bit' scummy. Why? I've even written paragraphs about how he is really scummy. He also accused me of something, in which I will quote the first part.
Quote:
His first few posts were question after question.

Wrong. My first few posts was answering the questions given to all of us, objecting to Panthera, 194, and Ramsey's argument 'about starting from scratch and trying to scumhunt from there'. Mr. Shoop, I can see that you are trying to accuse me of something I did not do. And I did not change the topic after I asked a question, a few posts later. I continued pushing Ramsey for answers, but he gave flawed excuses on why we should follow Panthera. I also did not go into 'defense mode'. You are trying to falsely accuse me of being scum, aren't you? With no solid evidence, I find it hard to believe you.
Lukepi:Null
Not many posts from him, so I can't make sure.
Thomas:Null
Not many posts from him, so I can't make sure.
Panthera:Scum
I have written many paragraphs against him, talking about how his logic is faulty and how he is trying to stall for time. A lot of people have also written arguments against him too.

Those are my reads. I won't be posting that much soon, since I'll have to go back to school on Monday(GMT+8).

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 1:35 am
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I believe I answered why I did not want to vote Cactus.

Mr. Shoop wrote:
Cactus didn't respond with something like "Why did you do that!?" or some similar reaction. It's no fun if they don't care.


If you would like me to elaborate upon this, I will. I know Cactus and consider him a friend of sorts, and wanted to see his reaction after I picked to vote him. As we know, Cactus was inactive for days on in. After a while of not seeing him post, I retracted my vote, seeing as I would not get a response any time soon. I had exactly the same motive for voting for 194, but people had mixed emotions for this so I once again retracted my vote.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 1:42 am
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Felipe, he wasn't at L-1. He was at L-3 I believe, and you've just put him at L-4.

JC- what exactly have you found scummy about some of my posts? I ask because you've been very vocal when everyone else did scummy things, but this is the first I'm hearing of your opinion of me.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:32 am
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Actually it's mostly JC and myself who multiquote/wall but you get the point.

Reads:
Town(S>W):Brikmaninoff, JamesClyde, TheOneWhoKnocks
Null(Town>Scum):194, Lightning, kyuubit, Felipe, Dephius, Blood, Shoop, Luke, Bonsai and Thomas tied.
Scum(S>W):Ramsey, Panthera, King Arthur.

If thou request of me to provide sufficient explanation, I will.

Felipe's it's L-4 now lol.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:36 am
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Vote: Pant

Srry, got confused with the hammer thing.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:44 am
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Felipe, reads?

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:47 am
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First of all, Towk, you were using the metagame argument against me. You said, and I quote:
Quote:
Oh, that makes sense.
JamesClyde
Scummy feeling from posts and seems to be acting the same as his previous game, where he was scum. Discuss.

Quote:
Scummy feeling from posts and seems to be acting the same as his previous game, where he was scum.

Therefore, I have deduced then that you had a logical fallacy in your post, the 'Hitler Built Autobahns'.
Here's an example.
'You did X as scum in the last game I played with you, and you have done it here. Therefore, you are scum.'
And you said:
Quote:
Scummy feeling from posts and seems to be acting the same as his previous game, where he was scum.

Just to reassure you of your logical fallacy. It's strange that King Arthur had that logical fallacy in his post against me as well.

However, that's probably the only thing I have against you. Your posts after that had more meat in their bones, so I'd say you're still null, but leaning more towards town.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:08 am
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Mr. Shoop wrote:
I believe I answered why I did not want to vote Cactus.

Mr. Shoop wrote:
Cactus didn't respond with something like "Why did you do that!?" or some similar reaction. It's no fun if they don't care.


If you would like me to elaborate upon this, I will. I know Cactus and consider him a friend of sorts, and wanted to see his reaction after I picked to vote him. As we know, Cactus was inactive for days on in. After a while of not seeing him post, I retracted my vote, seeing as I would not get a response any time soon. I had exactly the same motive for voting for 194, but people had mixed emotions for this so I once again retracted my vote.

Objection!
Firstly, you stated that you wanted a no-lynch on Day 1, but you did not unvote your vote on 194. Also, in your list of reads, you accused me of many things that I did not do. Your entire argument against me had no real evidence, and is fundamentally flawed.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:51 am
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For the record, I've said before that vote on you was only semi-serious. It was more to start discussion (hence the "Discuss.") than "holy s*** this actually means he's scum lynch em"

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:58 am
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Mmm...

JamesClyde's posts have been declining in clarity, it seems. Where once I sensed unadulterated town intent, I feel now signals most confusing. Could he be falling back into old patterns, unaware of his doing so? Perhaps he seeks too strongly for incriminating material and finds what is not there.

Accusations based on meta alone are not the logical fallacy that you propose. They are weak and should not be relied upon, but at the beginning of a game they provide something with which to work. Pattern recognition is a useful skill when playing with people that one is familiar with, and I am not certain that its use can be labelled "scummy" without analyzing the context.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:01 am
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Saying Objection! doesnt make them real objections, it only makes your posts more annoying.

Terra, i gave mines pages ago, they havent changed much.

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:25 am
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Brikmaninoff wrote:
Mmm...

JamesClyde's posts have been declining in clarity, it seems. Where once I sensed unadulterated town intent, I feel now signals most confusing. Could he be falling back into old patterns, unaware of his doing so? Perhaps he seeks too strongly for incriminating material and finds what is not there.

Accusations based on meta alone are not the logical fallacy that you propose. They are weak and should not be relied upon, but at the beginning of a game they provide something with which to work. Pattern recognition is a useful skill when playing with people that one is familiar with, and I am not certain that its use can be labelled "scummy" without analyzing the context.


I think I know what he means, as I've seen the Wiki page, which is here, and even used it in this game, but was ninja'd by JC himself.

Basically what he means is that unless someone says that he has a significant tendency to play the way he does in his scum game only as scum, then no accusations on his meta can be made.

Felipe_9595 wrote:
Terra, i gave mines pages ago, they havent changed much.


You sound annoyed lol.
Null on me? Generally people have made a decision about my alignment, but you haven't. What are your thoughts on me?

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:55 am
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Claim? OK. I'm the lucky physician. Before you off me with your votes, take into account that I can protect you from a night kill, and that I also have the passive ability to survive one day lynch, but only one.

Nice, huh? :)

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Sat Jan 05, 2013 9:25 am
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