View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently Mon Oct 14, 2019 4:07 am



Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 
My (Odd) Tier List. 

Who do YOU think works best with Keyboard Controls?
Marth 7%  7%  [ 1 ]
Black Mage 13%  13%  [ 2 ]
Zelda 7%  7%  [ 1 ]
Sheik 20%  20%  [ 3 ]
Naruto 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Pikachu 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Meta Knight 13%  13%  [ 2 ]
Tails 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Mega Man 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
None of the Above Options 40%  40%  [ 6 ]
Total votes : 15

My (Odd) Tier List. 
Author Message

Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:49 pm
Posts: 1
Country: United States (us)
Reply with quote
Disclaimer: I kind of suck at competitive SSF2. So, please, do not take this as something that should be taken too seriously. I just wanted to kind of put this out there for the heck of it.

Now, I say this is an "Odd" Tier List is because I'm not as lucky as the rest of the more experienced players, and I don't have any controllers to play SSF2 with to try and get better. So, I have to deal with a keyboard on a laptop. It works well, it's just... not the best thing, I can only imagine. So, this is sort of a "Keyboard" Tier List, if you will. In my experience with using keyboard as the main peripheral, it's been... eh. It can work, but it's not the best thing ever. Also in my personal experience, using keyboard forces me to use a lot of aerial moves, which sucks a little, but I can deal with it, I guess.

I'll be basing this mostly off what I've done through some testing through Training Mode, some general knowledge of what the meta-game wants (well, my knowledge, at least), and how they fare using keyboard controls. Again, please don't take this too seriously. (Th-This is my first tier list, go easy on me, plz)

Without further ado, here it is:

S: :marth: :blackmage: :zelda: :sheik: :naruto:
A: :pikachu: :metaknight: :tails: :megaman:
B:(+) :goku: :peach: :lloyd: :bomberman: :donkeykong: :ness: :yoshi: :sora: (-) :jigglypuff: :zerosuitsamus: :link: :wario: :chibirobo: :captainfalcon: :samus:
C:(+) :kirby: :ichigo: (-) :fox: :sonic:

Yup. It's ugly.

I had a good time with most of these characters using keyboard. It's just that certain characters failed to shine over others for certain reasons.

S Tier:

~ Marth: I put Marth here mostly because he almost seems built to be used by pretty much anyone, and can be used well. From my experience with him, it has been no real problem using Marth, besides some occasions where I do Up-Tilts instead of Up-Airs, and vice versa, but otherwise, he's just a very solid keyboard character. His short-hop Fair is very good, and can combo into grabs at early percents. So can Nair in that case.

- Black Mage: Again, another solid character. However, he sort of lacks the true kill power Marth possesses. However, Marth doesn't have as amazing a recovery as Black Mage. He can virtually reappear wherever he feels like, really. Short hop Fair can combo into more Fairs, which is fun. Again, no real trouble using Black Mage.

- Zelda: Zelda can either be very weak or very strong. In my opinion, Zelda can be outstanding if using keyboard, as it's very easy to guide aerials, grabs, and even her odd F-Tilt to some crazy kills. Her recovery might not be as good, and she has some trouble finding openings in certain situations, but she still works well.

- Sheik: Really, Sheik just barely made it into S Tier. She has solid air game, and her needles can be a pain if used correctly. However, she does have to deal with her meh recovery, and she can be killed quite early if the other player knows what they're doing. Despite this, I still think Sheik can barely manage S Tier, even with keyboard controls.

A Tier:

~ Pikachu: This little fella is very good. With one of the best recoveries in the game, and with some good options for basically any situation. Approaching, staying in neutral, good ledge-guarding options, Pikachu has it all. Pretty much the Jack of all Trades in Smash. However, because of this, I think Pikachu is barely top A Tier, as it can be a little tricky trying to control the little fella. It wasn't as bad as some other characters, however.

- Meta Knight: What do I have to say about Meta Knight that hasn't been said already?... Eh, not much. Usual "Meta Knight" is so good reasons without the real bias and the obligatory "Meta Knight is OP" because... he kind of isn't. His recovery, despite being very good, can be a bit of a pain in the a**. He's also a bit fast for keyboard, both on land and mid-air, but if you keep at it long enough, you could get used to how Meta Knight feels with keyboard.

- Tails: Tails is pretty cool. Has a decent projectile, can get back on the stage pretty well, some surprisingly quick moves, and a quick spike, at that. His recovery could be better, but it's good maybe as a "get off of me" option. Not too much to say about Tails, he's just pretty good.

- Mega Man: Mega Man has a lot of options, obviously. And not only that, he has 5 different neutral specials, all good for different things. Charge Shot as a basic projectile, Black Hole Bomb to trap for easy combos, Sticky Bomb to apply shield pressure, Metal Blade for ground coverage, and Rocks to be rocks and be thrown really hard and hurt people a lot. Again, recovery could be better, but it still works well enough. Not much to over-ride faster characters and the like.

B Tier (Boy, there's a lot):

B+

~ Goku: I put Goku on here just above Peach because they pretty much have the same moveset, only Goku uses it better. That, and he has a better projectile in my opinion. Goku can stall, edge guard really well, his short hop Fair is amazing, and since he can float, he can get more short hop Fairs off of the first one. His horizontal recovery is fantastic, and his vertical recovery gets the job done well enough.

- Peach: Not much to say about Peach, just a Goku with turnips. And a not-as-great recovery option.

- Lloyd: Again, not too much to say about Lloyd. Just Marth, only with more variations on how to kill, a few moves with big end-lag, and a not-as-good recovery. If his recovery was better, he would be much higher, that's all I have to say.

- Bomber-Man: Bomber-Man is an oddball. He has a fantastic recovery, one of the best in the game... and then his Side-Special is a simple spin kick... Well, I guess you gotta work with something. He can cover the stage very well using bombs of various sizes, and it can be tough to even get to him if he's camping well enough. Very good air mobility, might I say, and his Up-Air is amazingly fast and powerful.

- Donkey Kong: How to summarize DK... Big, hits hard, gets combo'd easy, meh recovery, lotsa spikes. The end.

- Ness: I put Ness after Yoshi because I feel he has more options. Plenty of ways to rack up damage, good coverage, a powerful kill move... it's just his recovery can be hard to maneuver with keyboard controls, which threw him way downward. It's awkward, and you have to do it surprisingly quick.

- Yoshi: This is mostly because Ness has the ability to recover. If Yoshi finds himself too low beneath the stage, he's a flat out goner if A) his double jump is gone, or B) his double jump can't reach. Otherwise, his eggs can be a bit hard to throw using keyboard controls... maybe it's because I can't do it fast enough, but it can be hard.

- Sora: Sora's at the borderline between B+ and B-, and I put him in + because he just has really good combo game. He doesn't have many kill moves, but his combos can lead into a good F-Smash or Up-Smash if timed right.

B-

~ Jigglypuff: I put Jigglypuff just at the top of B- because I feel her combo game isn't as good as Sora's. However, with the aided assistance of Rest and her many jumps, she can make it back way easier than Sora can... if she lives long enough to outlast Sora.

- ZS Samus: I put ZS here because she can be very awkward to control. She has good moves, but her Paralyzer can be hard to hit if you're not used to it, and can be even harder with keyboard. Her Flip Kick and Up+B can be problems too, but that can be settled another time with a better tier list.

- Link: Now, Link is here because he can kill in many different ways. Besides Up-Smash for some reason. He has D-Tilt, D-Smash, F-Smash, Up-Tilt, Up-Air, Up+B, Down-Air, plenty of moves to kill. He also has crazy projectile game... now if only his wind-up wouldn't be so hard to master with keyboard, he'd be much higher.

- Wario: I put Wario here for the same reason as ZS: he is very awkward to controls. On land, his dash is very bad, but then in the air he moves like a piece of paper, awkwardly stopping to move in another direction. He has good aerial combo game, I'm sure, but I couldn't see it using keyboard.

- Chibi-Robo: Now... Chibi v Falcon... this was a toughy. Both are heavy, have meh recovery options, but can be very threatening if given the chance... I put Chibi up ahead of Falcon because Chibi has a projectile, has damage racking options, and despite his Dair being very small, it comes out way faster and it hits much harder than Falcon's. He's also easier to use with keyboard... albeit, that isn't saying too much.

- Captain Falcon: Not saying Falcon is bad, oh no. I'm just saying Chibi has more options in general. Falcon can hit just as hard, if not harder, as Chibi can. Of course, everything combos into knee. It's just hard to do it on keyboard.

- Samus: Samus just barely made the cut from C+ to B- because she can power through using projectile game. She can also recover, and her moves are surprisingly hard to DI from if the Samus player knows what they're doing. She's also pretty nice to control using keyboard.

C Tier:

C+

~ Kirby: Kirby couldn't quite make the cut, mostly because (in my opinion) Kirby can't kill as well. Most of Kirby's moves send the opponent in arbitrary ways, ie F-Smash connecting to the floor. Maybe I'm just not using him right, but he just doesn't kill in my opinion. Albeit, he can be useful with keyboard.

- Ichigo: Think of Ichigo like Ike from Brawl... except make his moves easily predictable and have major wind-up and end-lag. And add a decent projectile. That's Ichigo in a nutshell for ya... Oh, and make his recovery about as good as DK's without the ability to aid it in any way, shape or form.

C-

~ Fox: And now we've reached the bottom of the barrel. Fox is just too damned heavy to be used with keyboard controls. He just can't be used properly, and most of his moves are near identical to the ones in Melee. It's also very hard to use tech with Fox, really.

- Sonic: Aaand then there's Sonic... Listen, I am not - in ANY circumstance - saying Sonic is bad. I'm just saying he's bad if you're using keyboard controls. He moves way too fast, his Smashes are meh at best, with F-Smash being his best (and also his fastest to wind-up, and shortest), and his grab game is just... no. He can't work with keyboard controls, he just can't, I swear.

And that's my terrible tier list for keyboard controls. Hope you liked it! Although, I don't think you did.


Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:01 am
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:09 am
Posts: 135
Gender: N/A
MGN Username: Ninjawarrior93
Currently Playing: SSF2
Reply with quote
I think that you might have forgotten to put Naruto in your S Tier explanation.

Just want to point out that most players here play with keyboards, or at least I do.

_________________
:peach:


Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:54 am
Profile
SSF2 Developer
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:47 pm
Posts: 2316
Location: BC
Country: Canada (ca)
Gender: Male
Currently Playing: Complacency breeds weakness. My opponents won't stop getting stronger, neither will I.
Reply with quote
Ninjawarrior93 wrote:
I think that you might have forgotten to put Naruto in your S Tier explanation.

Just want to point out that most players here play with keyboards, or at least I do.

This is certainly true, which is why I find it ironic that the OP said "I'm not as lucky as the more experienced players", referring to having a controller as lucky.

As for my thoughts on a Keyboard tier list, every character except for Sheik and Zelda are just as capable on controller as they are on keyboard. Some of the faster characters and more technical characters, like Fox/Falcon/Tails, tend to be more difficult to play on controller (especially Fox), but with time technical skills can be retained. I list Sheik/Zelda as exceptions, because they have a technique that requires you to have a button that goes left and a button that goes right. This can be accomplished on a controller, but imo is very awkward and out of the standard layouts for controllers.

Overall though, the general trend through this tier list is difficulty to play increases as you go down the chart.

_________________
Men that are trapped by the chains of "maybe" can never reach their dreams!
The weak are washed away by the tides of fate. The strong drink it up.
No matter the man, we all wear masks. Whether it be over our faces or over our hearts.

Youtube: NinjaLobsterStudios
Stream: twitch.tv/ninjalobster

Click to expand thumbnail


Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:29 am
Profile
BR Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2014 1:33 pm
Posts: 2000
Country: Germany (de)
Gender: Male
MGN Username: TSF|Cookies
Currently Playing: PM, Melee, Ultimate, Hollow Knight
Reply with quote
Doomsdaydevice01 wrote:
Zelda: Her recovery might not be as good


WHAT

_________________
Join Team Star Flash!
Image


Shoutouts to Harr for this sick player card!

Join Chibi Nation, the 20CR Discord for all aspiring Chibi-Robo mains!

Click to expand thumbnail


Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:05 am
Profile WWW
BR Member
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:58 pm
Posts: 1812
Location: Everywhere and Nowhere
Country: United Kingdom (uk)
Gender: Male
MGN Username: CSWooly
Skype: CSWooly
Currently Playing: Fire Emblem Fates: Birthright, SSF2, SSB4, League of Legends.
Reply with quote
Mario is missing.

_________________
Follow me on Twitter here.
Youtube channel.

Image

Click to expand thumbnail

SSF2 Backroom Character Analyst and Labber


Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:23 am
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2015 12:31 pm
Posts: 341
Gender: N/A
Reply with quote
The difficulty of using a character has nothing to do with tiers just to let you know. Fox is tough to use in Melee, but that isn't a bad thing about him. If he's mastered, he's a huge threat in the competitive scene, as shown by Melee's top players. I guess you can say the same with SSF2, as there is SoldierSunday, DescendedSun, and Aegis, who are arguably the best Fox players in SSF2. They have seem to overcome the "difficulties" of using Fox that others seem to struggle at. I'm not trying to say Fox is the best in the game, but I recommend you don't use the difficulty of using a character from here on out.

_________________
Image
Kaioken is red
Rasengan is blue
Why are anime characters in SSF2


Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:45 am
Profile
BR Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2015 9:52 pm
Posts: 387
Location: Killafornia
Country: Philippines (ph)
Gender: Male
Skype: dopenessvg
Currently Playing: w/ emotions
Waifu: joey
Reply with quote
Because the game only recognizes 8 directions, keyboard is actually one of the best, if not THE best, controllers for the game. Many "advanced" techniques (like the one Godot was talking about) can only be performed/easier to perform on keyboard. The way you talk about keyboard playing makes it seem like they are at a disadvantage when in reality that isn't the case at all. The vast majority of top players use keyboard so you can't use the fact that you use keyboard to create a tier list thats based off keyboard-specific play when really all characters can be played exceptionally well no matter what controller is being used

EDIT: After looking at the actual tier list, its unfortunately barely even a tier list at all. The way you organized your characters into tiers are based on how easy or good they can perform on keyboard. It is biased and mostly inaccurate (characters like Fox, Metaknight, etc. are played at some of the highest levels of the competitive metagame with keyboard). I think you failed to realize that a tier list is supposed to represent a character's viability and presence in the metagame, because from what I've read from your reasoning and placements you just based it off what you felt was easy to use on your control scheme.

_________________


Last edited by doPe on Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.



Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:39 am
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:19 pm
Posts: 1417
Location: In the world of SSF2 Beta
Country: Canada (ca)
Gender: Male
MGN Username: ShadowAssasin2600
Skype: chaoticshadow50
Currently Playing: Life.
Reply with quote
My reaction to Black Mage and Fox's placement

Image

_________________
Mains : :mario: :luigi:
Image


Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:52 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:19 pm
Posts: 1417
Location: In the world of SSF2 Beta
Country: Canada (ca)
Gender: Male
MGN Username: ShadowAssasin2600
Skype: chaoticshadow50
Currently Playing: Life.
Reply with quote
Also you forgot :mario:

_________________
Mains : :mario: :luigi:
Image


Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:53 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2014 4:27 pm
Posts: 468
Country: United Kingdom (uk)
Gender: Anime Girl
MGN Username: ohgosick
Skype: uberoo1
Currently Playing: Anything not called 'Undertale'.
Waifu: ur mum lmao
Reply with quote
Quote:
just a Goku with turnips.

...

_________________
Image

The Americans came in and burned my village with their flaming uppercuts,
killing our water buffalo and leaving this scar on my chest...


Thu Dec 10, 2015 6:48 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 10 posts ] 

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Designed by ST Software for PTF.