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Super Mario RPG Mini Mafia [Night 1] 
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@TOWK: I don't see the logic in your vote.

Please post more or I will have nothing to work with.

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Sun May 05, 2013 7:05 pm
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JamesClyde wrote:
*Tons of stuff about how colds make you feel*

During the first day or so with mine, I honestly can't think too straight. The funny thing is that Kyuubit mentioned this, too, I believe it was in Mods VS Users, and nobody jumped him for it there. Either way feeling a bit better so I'm gonna get some reads done.

Lucina: General town vibes, very good reasoning and logic, with how things are situational. Can't really blame you for going after me.
Terra: VERY detailed posts, posted some good questions which I'm going to answer after this, but the thing is, even when he was the one keeping the pseudo-vote count in Smash Bros Mafia, he flipped scum. (Again, not afraid to reference dead people in that game because of revealed roles and such)
Nixter: No reads, lurking. I don't know if he's playing bad town, or what, but not sharing your reads when you have some isn't a good thing. Scum vibe right here.
TOWK: Well, you called Nixter out for having no reads, and then saying you had no reads yourself. You also had some good town logic with how certain things are situational, like everybody else did, granted, this could be just using common knowledge to try for a town read, though. Dangit you also just ninja'd me with voting JC. Null-hardly-considered scum.
JC: Well, you're a bit of a mixed bag. You seem like you're trying to be town right now, with highly detailed posts, but you're also pointing out the obvious with Nixter's lurks. Null-scum till you post a bit more.
[:]: Null, you need to post more.

~~~

Quote:
1)What is your view on Lynch All Lurkers?
Like everybody else said, it's situational. They could be out of things to post or such. With Nixter, I honestly am not really sure, it could go either way, knowing him.
2)What is your view on Lynch All Liars?
Lucina said this perfectly, really. While a huge chunk of lies can be mafia members, a good example of this being used for town would be Cowboys VS Cattle rustlers, where you pretty much has to give Geno a gold star for his lies that delayed the mafia from killing him, and helped out the town so much.

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Sun May 05, 2013 7:16 pm
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JamesClyde wrote:
TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
I really don't have any reads yet, not enough has happened yet. All of you are still null

Please tell me why Arthur saying he might need temporary replacement is scummy at all. The only time replacing out is scummy is when the person is under pressure, and even then it's pretty situational. This is not one of those situations when he's scummy.

Let me explain. Arthur abruptly asked for a temporary replacement in the midst of the game. But as to the reason he gave for that... was a very bad one. He said he had a cold, and that affected his reasoning. But actually, all a cold does is make you cough, have a sore throat, make your nose run, makes you sneeze, and gives you a fever. That, in itself, does not affect your reasoning so much that you have to get a temporary replacement to play for you. But after a few posts of people suspecting him, he said that he would 'do his best' and start posting again. Doesn't that seem scummy to you at all? My scum-dar is tingling with scummyness and it's pointing to King Arthur.

~~~~~~~

HEY WAIT GUYZ I JUST NOTICED. Since we were all caught up in our arguments, we haven't noticed Nixter lurking.
VOTE: Nixter

I seriously doubt Arty would used a cold as a weapon because he is a super scum mastermind.

Come on.

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Sun May 05, 2013 7:19 pm
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Nixter wrote:
I seriously doubt Arty would used a cold as a weapon because he is a super scum mastermind.

Come on.

Thanks

Even if in the one game where I was scum I was lynched Day 1 and the town won

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Actually,
Vote: JC

Also, DJ, I'm not trusting anymore of your post restrictions unless you give me a logical flavor reason for why you're restricted.

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Sun May 05, 2013 8:50 pm
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Vote: JC

might as well

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JC IS AT L-1 SO NO ONE HAMMER UNTIL JC RESPONDS.

Also, DJ, please answer my question: I'll excuse you for the rest of the day if so.

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Voting Lucina:
Voting TOWK:
Voting [:]:
Voting Nixter: King Arthur, JamesClyde (L-2)
Voting Terra: [:]
Voting JamesClyde: Towk, Terra, Nixter (L-1)
Voting King Arthur: Lucina

Not voting:

With 7 people playing, it takes 4 users to lynch.


Sun May 05, 2013 9:45 pm
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Post 3/5, making a response to everything of interest.
Any questions will be answered under their respective quotes... if I miss any I'll do them in my next post...

JamesClyde wrote:
Terra wrote:
1)What is your view on Lynch All Lurkers?

2)What is your view on Lynch All Liars?


1) Perhaps a townie could just be lurking to find scum who are highly opportunistic, the scum obviously trying to lynch the 'lurker'. The townie would probably be lynched before he has a chance to explain himself.

2) Lynch all liars, huh? We won't know whether they're liars or not until we have real concrete proof that they're lying, or that they're telling the truth. But after weighing the drawbacks of not lynching liars and lynching liars, I'd say that I'd go with lynching liars, as they will most likely be mafia, since townies don't usually lie.

Answer 1) is illogical if you read if thoroughly.
Lucina wrote:
Terra wrote:
1)What is your view on Lynch All Lurkers?

2)What is your view on Lynch All Liars?

1. Some people just naturally lurk, even as town. And scum can be active too, so it's kind of situational.

2. Normally, liars are scum because tricking the town into lynching each other is their goal. Town can lie too, if they want to keep the mafia from killing them. Again, situational.

With that being said, Vote: King Arthur

This is a funky vote because it comes right after King Arthur's original cold post.
Terra wrote:
Lucina wrote:
Terra wrote:
1)What is your view on Lynch All Lurkers?

2)What is your view on Lynch All Liars?

1. Some people just naturally lurk, even as town. And scum can be active too, so it's kind of situational.

2. Normally, liars are scum because tricking the town into lynching each other is their goal. Town can lie too, if they want to keep the mafia from killing them. Again, situational.

With that being said, Vote: King Arthur


But even if they naturally lurk, they're being inherently anti-town, right? There's still no reason not to post.

What if someone is caught in a claim and is found to be lying? Would you lynch them?

Also, we need more activity from Nixter, TOWK and DJ.

This post comes right after Lucina's post, again, 'nother funky vote.
Actually really weird situation here if you think about it. Experience would dictate either Lucina/Terra is scum.
Nixter wrote:
Lurking is sorta bad IMO

it's very anti productive and very defensive, which is exactly what scum want

Agreed. Sorry about lurking... I have to make my posts count. You suck Geno.
Lucina wrote:
Terra wrote:
Lucina wrote:
Terra wrote:
1)What is your view on Lynch All Lurkers?

2)What is your view on Lynch All Liars?

1. Some people just naturally lurk, even as town. And scum can be active too, so it's kind of situational.

2. Normally, liars are scum because tricking the town into lynching each other is their goal. Town can lie too, if they want to keep the mafia from killing them. Again, situational.

With that being said, Vote: King Arthur


But even if they naturally lurk, they're being inherently anti-town, right? There's still no reason not to post.

What if someone is caught in a claim and is found to be lying? Would you lynch them?

It depends. I usually sit back and weigh things before posting; it just makes my posts more useful. It's better than "I'm posting just to stay active blah blah." Those are my least favorite kind of posts. I do find excessive lurking suspicious, though.

Depending on how my top scum reads react to it, maybe.

Now I have a question: How do you feel about Arthur wanting to be replaced? I find it a bit strange, personally.

@Nixter: Is that really how you feel about lurking or is it just because it's what we want to hear?

Interesting post, coincides with his earlier vote... Terra/Lucina action is interesting...
Asks a question to Nixter, Nixter's response:
Nixter wrote:
Well, I'm not talking about posting just for the sake of posting s okay, if one was lurking for a long period of time, no good is done, if someone posts every other post to appear active and town, yet not providing anything, then that's scummy, too.

filler posts = bad
prolonged lurking = bad
insightful posts = good


that's how I see it



Nixter wrote:
Vote: JC
Actually dodges Lucina's original question. The response feels like even more of a what we want to hear post...
TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
Lucina's right, both LALiars and LALurkers are entirely situational. For the most part though lyncher lurkers isn't productive, as lynching someone who's given no info doesn't help. I prefer to just have them replaced

Replace all lurkers is my policy as well.
King Arthur wrote:
I can't really make much sense as long as I'm sick, and I thought I mentioned the replacement being just a temp one till I felt better

I'll try to do my best till somebody steps up/I feel better.


To be honest with you, I wish I'd just get a cold when nothing is blooming. Preferably when it's actually cold outside.

IDK usually my Day 1 reads are right (except on KA) and I'm getting a town vibe from KA. I find the immediate votes by Lucina and Terra disconcerting.
Colds suck.
Terra wrote:
I think Arthur is being entirely honest. Scum tend to replace out if they're under pressure and he's not under any as of this post, so I do think that he's not joking around.
WOAH WOAH WOAH THEN WHY WERE YOU STILL VOTING KING ARTHUR WHEN YOU MADE THIS POST SIR
AND NEED I REMIND YOU YOU VOTED KING ARTHUR RIGHT AFTER HIS COLD POST


@Nixter: I agree with Lucina's point, although I have another question to ask.
Agreeing with other people's posts or generally accepted opinions is another form of lurking: in fact, iirc it's called Active Lurking. Who is your top town-read/scum-read and why?

Forming some good reads right now, but keeping them a secret for further observation.
I still don't understand this. Terra's done this before and I don't understand why he does it.

Nixter wrote:
Nothing much has happened right now, I have no reads as of right now

No reads. Nix has complained about useless posts but makes small effort to create his own.
TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
Why are you hiding your reads this early in the game?
There's literally no reason to

Ugh TOWK stop agreeing with my brain.
Terra wrote:
TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
Why are you hiding your reads this early in the game?
There's literally no reason to


My reads are based on reactions: if I let them know specifically what reactions, I won't be allowed to use it later on, as the scum would specifically avoid doing what I call scummy.

Besides, imo earlygame is where scum is most vulnerable(they aren't used to the game yet): I'll take advantage of this while I can.

Personally disagree with Terra's philosophy. If someone's scummy then you lynch them.
If the scum changes their playstyle suddenly, wouldn't you interpret that as a huge scumtell?
What does the last line mean? Scum's vulnerable so you won't share your reads with us? What?
How is that taking advantage of the weak scum?
TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
You don't have to tell them why you think they're scum ya know. If you say you think they're scum and they change their playstyle, hey another scumread
I SAID STOP TOWK
And making reads based off the first 4 pages of things usually isn't a good thing, especially when 1 page is confirmations and the rest is RQS

JamesClyde wrote:
Nixter wrote:
Lurking is sorta bad IMO

it's very anti productive and very defensive, which is exactly what scum want

Nixter, if the mafia already know that lurking is bad and will lead the town to suspect them, why would the scum want it? It's not defensive at all since the mafia can't answer back. However, the anti productive part of that argument is right. Still, I got my eye on you. Literally. IGMEOY
~~~~~~~

Lucina wrote:
How do you feel about Arthur wanting to be replaced?

I think it's quite suspicious. Nixter typed something like that in MG Mafia 12 Moderators VS Users, and as it turns out, his alignment was that of the third party. Perhaps King Arthur could be third party. We don't know for sure.
Nixter full out CLAIMED THE MAFIA WIN CONDITION in 12. And THERE IS NO THIRD PARTY HERE. OP states 5v2.
~~~~~~~

@[:]
I think you'd better stop lurking and start posting.
Well excuse me for having a post restriction.
~~~~~~~

Terra wrote:
Requesting main scumread/townread from everyone please:
Reads 1.0(these reads are by no means definitive but it's a good feeling):
Town(S>W): TOWK.
Null(Town>Scum): JC, Luc, Arthur, DJ.
Scum(S>W) Nixter.

Man, it looks so much less awesome when you only have a few people to analyze.

TOWK's not playing to his scum meta here: as town(iirc, MG Mafia 11), he played in a calm, commenting manner before analyzing people, and I expect him to do the same here.
As mafia, he did not try to initiate discussion at the beginning of the game, instead letting others lead. It sounds about the same, but this townread is pending further info.
IDK IMO TOWK is null. I agree with almost everything he says but there's no overarching sense of productivity like I'm used to TOWK having.

JC is town for actually trying to produce content, but I don't like how he suspects Nixter solely on the basis of a weak argument.
JC suspects Nixter for roughly the same reasons as you, and both of your guys' reasons aren't great.

Luc is town for initiating the RQS, but not much else, hence the null-town read.
I don't like Luc's Arthur vote.

Arthur is null for me: I haven't found anything useful in his posts just yet.
See above.

DJ's posts don't have anything useful in them, and his absence worries me a little.
I actually don't have any posts at all.

Refer to previous posts for why my scumread is on Nixter.
I just read through them, active lurking?

Lucina wrote:
If I can even call these reads: show
2. TOWK: I agree with Terra. Scum TOWK is quick to jump on someone. When not doing that, he's quite helpful. Null leaning town

3. [:]: Hasn't said much. (Answered a RQS question) Null leaning scum

4. Nixter: Is trying at least. Not sure whether to take that as town Nixter wanting to contribute or scum Nixter wanting for us to agree with him so we think he's town. Null

5. Terra: Good posts and reads overall. I just don't see why he doesn't think Arthur wanting a replacement is suspicious. I once replaced a guy wanting to be replaced day 1 and he ended up being scum. Null

6. JamesClyde: Isn't attacking hard like he usually does. I think he wants to help the town just as much as he wants to lynch the mafia, so it's a good thing imo. Plus, I've got that gut feeling again. Null leaning town

7. King Arthur: Is doing exactly what he said he would do; not much. At this point, I think it would be better if he was replaced because this "cold" is making him contribute even less than he usually would. His last post irks me. Null with a slight tinge of scum
Coincides with Lucina's early Arthur vote and reasons for vote.

TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
I really don't have any reads yet, not enough has happened yet. All of you are still null

Please tell me why Arthur saying he might need temporary replacement is scummy at all. The only time replacing out is scummy is when the person is under pressure, and even then it's pretty situational. This is not one of those situations when he's scummy.

...again I completely agree with this post.
Lucina wrote:
[:] wrote:
Been waiting on a role clarification, mine's kinda complex and it affects everything I'm allowed to do. I'm only allowed to post 5 times per day. :c

And what happens if you go over the 5 post limit?
Loss of night action.

Looking back, I think it's more the reason Arthur wanted temp replacing.

I don't really see how a common cold can affect someone's reasoning that bad.
But that's just me, since I've won a game or two while bedridden myself.

I just don't want this to be an excuse not to post and see him posting willy nilly everywhere else.
Terra wrote:
[:] wrote:
Been waiting on a role clarification, mine's kinda complex and it affects everything I'm allowed to do. I'm only allowed to post 5 times per day. :c

Vote: Terra

General Null read from him so far, as his posts have been somewhere between scum Terra and town Terra.
Since he publicly announced his scum playstyle in the tips and tricks thread, it's possible he's changed his scum playstyle as that's what we're all looking for etc, etc.

Town read from Lucina, actually town read from KA, null on everyone else.


Could you clarify what you think scum Terra would post and what town Terra would post in my posts, at least?
It's a kinda intuition thing... you know?
Scum Terra in general is more careful than you're being, Town Terra is usually more agressive than you're being.
You're playing in between the two.
From my above analyses of your posts I'm leaning more towards a scum read.

@Luc: Probably a modkill/loss of ability, similar to your post restriction in 13(Mods Vs Users).
Also, I really think Arthur should've declared V/LA instead of replacing out, but I think he's serious. There is no incentive to replacing out in this situation for him, either to ease pressure or to get out of a sticky situation.

JamesClyde wrote:
TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
I really don't have any reads yet, not enough has happened yet. All of you are still null

Please tell me why Arthur saying he might need temporary replacement is scummy at all. The only time replacing out is scummy is when the person is under pressure, and even then it's pretty situational. This is not one of those situations when he's scummy.

Let me explain. Arthur abruptly asked for a temporary replacement in the midst of the game. But as to the reason he gave for that... was a very bad one. He said he had a cold, and that affected his reasoning. But actually, all a cold does is make you cough, have a sore throat, make your nose run, makes you sneeze, and gives you a fever. That, in itself, does not affect your reasoning so much that you have to get a temporary replacement to play for you. But after a few posts of people suspecting him, he said that he would 'do his best' and start posting again. Doesn't that seem scummy to you at all? My scum-dar is tingling with scummyness and it's pointing to King Arthur.

~~~~~~~

HEY WAIT GUYZ I JUST NOTICED. Since we were all caught up in our arguments, we haven't noticed Nixter lurking.
VOTE: Nixter

JC voting for Nixter...

Terra wrote:
Actually,
Vote: JC

Also, DJ, I'm not trusting anymore of your post restrictions unless you give me a logical flavor reason for why you're restricted.

Rolefisher
Liberal paraphrase from clarifying PM: You receive a limited amount of Mana per turn. As such, you may only post 5 times per day.
If you go over the limit, you will not be able to use your night action, but you may post as many times as you like until the next day.

Aaand BLARGHEDY SHMARGH I'm tired of this.

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Terra wrote:
JC IS AT L-1 SO NO ONE HAMMER UNTIL JC RESPONDS.

Also, DJ, please answer my question: I'll excuse you for the rest of the day if so.

It seems like Terra is trying to say that he can lynch whoever he wants, and that he is control of the town. Why else would he say 'I'll excuse you for the rest of the day'? And if it isn't lynching, what else could it be? He seems quite arrogant at this point, and that pings my scum-dar.

Nixter wrote:
Vote: JC

might as well

Why the bandwagon vote on me, Nixter? Please give a proper argument against me as to why you are voting for me before you try to lynch me.

Terra wrote:
Actually,
Vote: JC

Voting for someone without reasoning behind it. You even claimed that I was leaning towards town in your reads, but now you have abruptly voted for me with no reasoning behind it. Perhaps you are trying to speedlynch me. If so, why?

Did you guys notice that in each and every one of the bandwagon votes against me, there was no reasoning behind them? I'll place them in chronological order.

TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
Wow, you're right I didn't notice Nixter lurking



















Vote: JC

Terra wrote:
Actually,
Vote: JC

Also, DJ, I'm not trusting anymore of your post restrictions unless you give me a logical flavor reason for why you're restricted.

Nixter wrote:
Vote: JC

might as well


No reasoning behind any of those votes. And I expect Terra is going to try and accuse me of being 'cautious', which I am not. Actually, what I wonder is why Terra and Nixter jumped the wagon. However, I expect King Arthur to vote for me next. Anyhow, Terra is probably brimming with joy at the thought that 'he' is going to lynch me, and that he is superior over me. But I have my facts. I was bandwagoned against a group of bandwagoners who did not give even one reason as to why they are voting for me. So I expect to be lynched soon under a bandwagon that withholds no reasoning whatsoever.

Then again, why would townies bandwagon against another townie with no reasoning at all? 3 people in that wagon. 7 people in total. The chances that one of them is scum is more than average, as they gave no reasoning in their votes.

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I want Terra to give his reasons for voting JC before I give mine. I most certainly have reasons and would be oh so happy to oblige, but his vote really worries me. Also Nixter if you could please not so blatantly bandwagon that would be greaaat.

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All right, let's see...

@DJ: I voted Arthur because his above post was suspicious to me. Sorry I didn't mention the link between the two before. It definitely wasn't part of the RVS.

And Terra didn't vote for Arthur. Don't know where you got that part from.

But if JC is lynched and flips scum, I could definitely see one of his lynchers as his partner. All three of them gave no reasons for voting him so that is interesting.


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TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
I want Terra to give his reasons for voting JC before I give mine. I most certainly have reasons and would be oh so happy to oblige, but his vote really worries me. Also Nixter if you could please not so blatantly bandwagon that would be greaaat.


I'm very happy to oblige.

I find it weird that in one of JC's posts, he says that Arthur's one of his scumreads and built a nice long case on him and then procee to vote Nixter on lurking alone. I find JC'S-Arthur likely because of this.

Also, I wanted to see his reaction to pressure.

I just checked my role PM and I have information that means that one person is almost certainly scum, but it would require me to claim. Thoughts?

Busy rn so small post before I continue my walling.

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Terra wrote:
I just checked my role PM and I have information that means that one person is almost certainly scum, but it would require me to claim. Thoughts?.

Depending on who it is, then maybe.

If you say me though, I'm gonna slap you for being wrong.


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TheOneWhoKnocks wrote:
I want Terra to give his reasons for voting JC before I give mine. I most certainly have reasons and would be oh so happy to oblige, but his vote really worries me. Also Nixter if you could please not so blatantly bandwagon that would be greaaat.

JC used me as a scapegoat, that's why

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