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Princess Zelda
http://forums.mcleodgaming.com/viewtopic.php?f=119&t=44796
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Author:  Geno [ Mon May 29, 2017 1:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Princess Zelda

Discuss Zelda specific game-play here.

Author:  Z A L O [ Tue May 30, 2017 1:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

Still a freaking Guilty-Gear character. Don't like her Fast-fall speed being slower as it hurts her platform rushdown. But much of everything in her playstyle is in tact; frame-traps, combos, juggles, chain-grabs, reverse-hit setups to sweet-spots Kicks. Just all the stupid stullf like, free-recovering, easy setups to kill moves, safe Din's edgeguarding, Down-smash, being gone. So she isn't "pick-up, mash, win" anymore for lower-level play. I can play her very similar without much of a hitch, which I figured from watching Beta gameplay over the year.

EDIT: After, playing her more: her kill potential feels the same overall to, be honest. Her ability to approach to get in and use it is definitely worse though.

EDIT 2: So her full-jumps are higher too, but she doesn't reach the apex of jumps as soon as v0.9b, so she can't fast-fall at the rate she could before for movement. Bummer.

Author:  bunq [ Wed May 31, 2017 4:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

Zelda can shorthop double bair now.
And all of her magic/sweetspot effects are so pretty.

Author:  Emma [ Thu Jun 01, 2017 8:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

One thing is sure: zelda's beta is much lower than 0.9b

Kill-power :

Fsmash usmash bair : ridiculous

Faore's wind : hit or die

Din's fire : easy to dodge

Fair : Now she needs glasses

Dtilt : Exodus 20:13: Thou shalt not kill


Now The fastest characters > zelda's beta

Author:  tson [ Thu Jun 01, 2017 10:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

fair kos better than bair tho

Author:  Z A L O [ Fri Jun 02, 2017 12:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

My only thing is that people are camping or playing hit&run because of how Zelda's lack in mobility. She can't break through nuetrala with her limited approach, nor does she have a reliable projectile to force approach anymore, or a fast teleport to mix-up. So players dash-dance and runaround the stage landing single moves until they racks up damage to a kill; eventually narrowing any lead established and forcing a simple game to be a 6-7 minute match. Feels like a weird punishment for being loyal to the character all these years.

It's nice that she got to keep her cool combos and most of her best setups off throws, but it just doesn't matter if you can't get to use it on your opponents. Any character significant speed, Wario, Ness, Mega Man, easily control the flow of neutral over her.

I'm still going to ride it out with her. She has legit issues that will surely make her below the bar as a competitive character (and that bar shouldn't be lowered either).

Please consider an increase her fall-speed & fast-fall-speed to complement her new jump height, and a slightly faster dash speed. Just give her that, and I think that's have the little push she needs to avoid being forced to play the lame game.

To add: I understand Usmash is to setup up Uair/UpB follow ups, but I will say that she can't kill Wario DI'ing in at 160% with Fsmash, from the edge of BattleField. That's pretty absurd; the knockback angle is pointed way to high for that low-knockback. But hell, I'll allow it.

Author:  Emma [ Fri Jun 02, 2017 6:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

Yes, she has no efficient to approach and ridiculous mobility ( example: vs luigi mu it's 100 0 for luigi )

I personally consider now zelda lowtier, she is good for the trashcan ( such as zelda melee )

Author:  tson [ Fri Jun 02, 2017 6:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

nspec if you feel threatened, just don't get baited

Author:  Emma [ Fri Jun 02, 2017 7:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

0.9b :

Image

Beta :

Image

Author:  tson [ Fri Jun 02, 2017 7:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

in 9b and beta there's 3 frames that you cannot hit her towards the beginning at all, you just need to get a feel for the timing

Author:  Z A L O [ Fri Jun 02, 2017 9:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

Yeah, Emma. Zelda was nearly completely impossible to hit during Nayru's. That move alone let her rule certain match-ups.

But Nayru's was still reactable to shield. So she had to make that up for with Din's ground-detonations or Farore's mix-ups. There's little options to give her some control of neutral now, but I'll go more into what she can do for approaching later.

EDIT: fixed words.

Author:  Emma [ Fri Jun 02, 2017 2:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

Before/after comparison

Negative :

Din's fire 0.9b > Beta ( 0.9b attack and defend )

Fsmash usmash dsmash 0.9b >> Beta ( 0.9b Kills earlier )

Dtilt 0.9b > Beta ( 0.9b Can kill and combo with Dsmash )

Uair 0.9b > Beta ( 0.9b no landing lag and better hitbox )

Fair 0.9b >> Beta ( beta stronger but better hitbox in 0.9b )

Bair 0.9b >>> Beta

Nspecial 0.9b >> Beta ( useless in beta )

Positive :

Nair ( not easy to combo with SDI )

Utilt : Better recovery

Jab : Stun and better recovery

Dair seems slightly better

Edit : Despite her nerfs, she remains interesting ( Once properly controlled )

Author:  darkrinorex [ Tue Jun 06, 2017 10:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

She has really good combos imo, and her up b has a ton of range good lord. It's hard to get away from her, at-least for me.

Makes me think about trying her out and see if I will main her or not.

I wonder if she's better than shiek (besides the speed).

Author:  ThatDerp1 [ Wed Jun 07, 2017 9:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

TBH, I don't enjoy the new Zelda.


I appreciate her jab and the fact that up-b has actual priority/a consistent hitbox (Though it only really needed a few pixels before in 0.9b)... but everything else has been an almost direct nerf.


D-tilt is almost completely useless in most situations, having lost the ability to meteor/set up jab resets.

Dash-attack has far more ending lag and sets up into less things.

Most of her kill moves were nerfed, with f-smash and up-smash being incredibly weak/easy to d.i. out of and punish, fair losing its ability to effectively space while being slower, and bair not only being weaker but also having more lag. Yes, you can get two bairs off in a single short-hop, but that's because she has massive short-hops now. It's still slower.


Her short hops are awful.


Up-throw seemed to have lost quite a few setups, while back-throw has been greatly nerfed in terms of power.


Finally, her safe landing options (Din's fire and Faore's wind) against characters with more range are simply not effective. Especially Din's fire, considering that a good part of its utility came from its lasting hitbox.

Finally, the few buffs she did get didn't help her flaws, specifically her trash landing (Dash-dance, shield when she's near, then go for an OOSO. If she goes for Faore's wind, do the same thing but just shield immediately after she uses it) and her inability to deal with disjoints outside of a few moves. In addition, she now suffers from awful killing power, a bad approach, bad range on the ground and greatly reduced combo power.



T.L.D.R, use Ness. He seems to have stolen most of Zelda's good properties. Main flaws are speed and bad special moves, but he generally has 0.9b Zelda's power and properties with a few other tricks up his short sleeves.

Author:  Jan_Solo [ Thu Jul 06, 2017 7:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Princess Zelda

Can we have 0.9b SH back?

Also, what did you guys think of the previous zelda patches?

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