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Black Mage 
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It's my birthday
Can I have Fanta Mage back as a birthday present, SSF2 Devs
can a doop-erino get me some heckinnnn'
grape fanta
sponsored content of Bedoop Co. Gaming
for good ol' Augustus the Sixtytwenth
thanks and please :sandbag:

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Fri Aug 25, 2017 11:40 pm
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Bedoop wrote:
It's my birthday
Can I have Fanta Mage back as a birthday present, SSF2 Devs
can a doop-erino get me some heckinnnn'
grape fanta
sponsored content of Bedoop Co. Gaming
for good ol' Augustus the Sixtytwenth
thanks and please :sandbag:

you will see fanta sea mage on the roster but when u choose it its actually dark black mage

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Sat Aug 26, 2017 1:02 am
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Happy Birthday Bedoop!
8-)

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Sat Aug 26, 2017 11:49 am
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In 0.9b, you couldn't make a second thundaga until there wasn't one on the screen anymore. In Beta, you can make a new one and it just replaces the previous one. This seemingly tiny buff opens up an interesting(?) spammy playstyle where you can use horizontal teleports to more or less constantly camp around thundaga. This doesn't work against characters with a great countermeasure against projectiles, but powershields aren't an issue if you teleport past the thundaga and grab them before they can reflect it - as long as your opponent is too far away to move in and powershield it when it first appears. Also, if you immediately follow up a thundaga with a second one (say while edge guarding), people will often jump right into the second one if they fall back on 0.9b evasion habits, or they will spend time powershielding a thundaga that is about to disappear anyway.

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Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:51 pm
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svladcjelli42 wrote:
In 0.9b, you couldn't make a second thundaga until there wasn't one on the screen anymore. In Beta, you can make a new one and it just replaces the previous one. This seemingly tiny buff opens up an interesting(?) spammy playstyle where you can use horizontal teleports to more or less constantly camp around thundaga. This doesn't work against characters with a great countermeasure against projectiles, but powershields aren't an issue if you teleport past the thundaga and grab them before they can reflect it - as long as your opponent is too far away to move in and powershield it when it first appears. Also, if you immediately follow up a thundaga with a second one (say while edge guarding), people will often jump right into the second one if they fall back on 0.9b evasion habits, or they will spend time powershielding a thundaga that is about to disappear anyway.

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fsmashspam.zip


after watching that you make me want to pick him up again. that actually looks decent, but very punishable

the people you showed us werent really punishing you at all for charging, nor for doing the same thing continuously.

First replay the :donkeykong: couldve just jumped over the top plat after the first shock hit, and punished

:captainfalcon: always let you charge everything for free and he would always try to beat out the thunder.

Couldnt faster characters like him get behind you before your charge even comes out? or hit you from above?

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Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:07 pm
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It depends on knowing exactly how long you have before your opponent can get back to you. Against Sonic or Ichigo on a legal stage in neutral, probably not too viable. Against Ness or Falco or Fox or Pit, this stuff is completely useless. As a general rule though, it's not bad whenever your opponent has been knocked back too far to make it practical for BM to try to chase for a followup, and since BM has mobility issues, that can be a fair amount of the time. If BM is getting punished for doing this, that means the BM player hadn't bought themself enough time on that stage against that character.

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Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:29 am
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That literally shouldn't work against 90% of the cast LMAO

if ur thinking about using the laggiest recovery move in the game in order to camp you've got something wrong with ya

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Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:29 am
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^

Speaking of recovery, why is Warp so unresponsive to player inputs?What i mean that it takes quite a while for Mage to actually adjust his warp circle aim when changing directions, which make Up B mixups pretty much unviable. I dont think it would exactly break the character (maybe because Im not thinking this through, but in all honesty that can be said about this game's balance as a whole) and Warp being so unresponsive just feels super off.

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Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:19 pm
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Corvid Crow, I would take your opinion more seriously if you actually watched the games I posted. I've seen your mage from 0.9b and frankly think you're a little bit overrated. Dair isn't the only approach in the kit.

Edit: if you don't grok that horizontal teleport is better than BM's run at various distances I just don't know what to tell you, other than you're missing out.

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Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:48 pm
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svladcjelli42 wrote:
Corvid Crow, I would take your opinion more seriously if you actually watched the games I posted. I've seen your mage from 0.9b and frankly think you're a little bit overrated. Dair isn't the only approach in the kit.

Edit: if you don't grok that horizontal teleport is better than BM's run at various distances I just don't know what to tell you, other than you're missing out.


Easy, tiger. Watching your replays, both opponents were weak, and your play was pretty one-dimensional.

:donkeykong: : Couldn't even connect off up-throw with anything meaningful. He literally sat and watched you charge F-smash.

:captainfalcon: : Awful neutral; didn't even react to being hit by dash attack at ledge, just tumbling to death. He did nothing out of first-hit Nair, when grab, jab, literally anything would have sufficed.

Teleport has high startup, high endlag, and is completely telegraphed. Any player remotely paying attention should punish that nonsense. And the same can be said for powershielding or even just airdodging through F-smash. Two matches of opponents exerting literally zero counterplay against spammed BM smash attacks proves absolutely nothing. Very rarely do I put other players on the hot seat, except when your erroneous conclusions push you to unfairly lash out at another player. That's not cool, and you need to mind yourself before doing so.


Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:38 pm
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TSF|Skylar wrote:
it takes quite a while for Mage to actually adjust his warp circle aim when changing directions
It can only change direction once, and it's always at the same point, about halfway through the duration of the move.


Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:28 pm
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Refurin wrote:
TSF|Skylar wrote:
it takes quite a while for Mage to actually adjust his warp circle aim when changing directions
It can only change direction once, and it's always at the same point, about halfway through the duration of the move.


Im not sure if I should feel silly for never noticing that or get mad because that sounds hella artificial and dumb :chibirobo:

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Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:14 am
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I agree, it is dumb.

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Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:31 am
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The thing that isn't telegraphed about Teleport is the moment at which you reappear. You can teleport short distances. If you pay attention to your opponent, carefully time reappearance, and space correctly, you shouldn't normally be getting punished for it. You just have to win the second-guessing mind game.

Edit: rewatched the game against VTRcomics's DK, I think you (Manta) are misunderstanding the situation a bit. Every time it looks like VTRcomics is standing there doing nothing, they don't really have a good option to disrupt me. Due to spacing and the positions of platforms, their only fast-enough path to preventing the full charge from happening risks getting hit if I read their approach and release the smash, which I probably would (come to think of it, they could have used a precise dash cancel followed by dspec, then I'd have to release and hope for a clank).

The full charged smashes are not really for hitting your opponent with, they are for limiting their options and making them easier to predict. If it actually connects, that's just gravy.

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Sat Sep 09, 2017 3:13 pm
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svladcjelli42 wrote:
The thing that isn't telegraphed about Teleport is the moment at which you reappear. You can teleport short distances. If you pay attention to your opponent, carefully time reappearance, and space correctly, you shouldn't normally be getting punished for it. You just have to win the second-guessing mind game.

Edit: rewatched the game against VTRcomics's DK, I think you (Manta) are misunderstanding the situation a bit. Every time it looks like VTRcomics is standing there doing nothing, they don't really have a good option to disrupt me. Due to spacing and the positions of platforms, their only fast-enough path to preventing the full charge from happening risks getting hit if I read their approach and release the smash, which I probably would (come to think of it, they could have used a precise dash cancel followed by dspec, then I'd have to release and hope for a clank).

The full charged smashes are not really for hitting your opponent with, they are for limiting their options and making them easier to predict. If it actually connects, that's just gravy.


In order for teleport to not be blatantly punishable, you have to stay along the ground, so your opponent already has locked your location down to running either left or right. A good dash dance is all that's needed to bust you up for teleporting in freaking neutral.

I think you misunderstand how average that DK was. Even in the most limited of situations, doing nothing is usually the wrong answer. He could have easily shield-dropped into Nair; or done a walk-off Bair. Or just walked up to you with F-tilt to force a reaction. Or run-up shield. Or just grab you since F-smash takes days to come out. Or short-hop Giant Punch. The list goes on. And any character with a projectile completely negates whatever strategy you have going on.

Bad strategy working against bad players does not mystically become good strategy. At even a remotely high level, this is highly punishable


Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:43 pm
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